: 14 cashiers and 386 stores? How does that work?
> [{quoted}](name=14daysuspensionk,realm=EUNE,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=g8qd7yvg,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-01-14T19:33:42.423+0000) > > 14 cashiers and 386 stores? How does that work? They're moving onto electronic cash registers now to try and save even more money from having to pay people. Though 14 is underestimation (and this the memes and games page so whatever) the only reason to have 1 person to man those electronic cash registers is to confirm age requirements are met with certain items.
: > [{quoted}](name=ı Sona ı,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=9oP3AB8U,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-01-03T09:55:14.799+0000) > > Welcome to League of Legends! I think it would help if you tried watching a few videos or some live matches as well to really get the hang of it. The main map people play on is Summoners Rift which is 5 v 5, but there is also 3 v 3 at The Twisted Treeline, which is a good practicing ground to learn the basic concepts needed to aptly play the larger map! You should definitely give ARAM a try as well, that'll put you face to face with characters on the map on a constant basis so you can see how everyone else is moving! If everyone is running away, maybe you should to, but if everyone is running towards the enemy, maybe you should to! > > And I know they may be a bit boring, but the Bot, or A.I., games are valuable teaching tools as well. One of their main goals is to teach you to back off when you are low, and to be able to estimate your damage so that you can go all in on the enemy for a kill! > > What is also important is just knowledge. Knowledge of every character. This is an elaborate and colorful game of chess but it is a game of chess none the less. Each character is a piece and each piece does something differently. Anyone who wasn't familiar with chess and didn't learn what all the pieces did and how to move them would generally never hope to win even by accident. > > While that does seem like a bit of a learning curve its not like you have to learn them all by heart immediately! Just give them each a skim to get a "feel" of what they do or what they contribute. Who are the healers, who are the tanks, who are the mages, who are the assassins, who are the long range shooters, who likes to be in the jungle, and those who can do multiple things. You can see people streaming their matches on Twitch, YouTube, and you can also view Diamond+ player matches using the league client, as well as spectate anyone on your friends list who is playing! > > The use of wards, the purchase of items, where the enemy is, where your allies are, and where you are standing are all factors that need to be considered while playing the game on a constant basis, and are only the most base points to consider. > > Like anything you want to be good at it takes time and practice, but if you stick to it you'll get the hang of it in no time! Have fun and experiment and find what works for you, or copy what you see others doing! Could be you stumble upon a new op secret strategy that no one thought of and start copying, happens all the time! (and then the people at high rank steal it and take credit for it, lol!) If you play for fun, you're more likely going to win! Also, mute anyone who insults you, you don't need that in your life! > > See you on the rift summoner! > > {{sticker:katarina-love}} > > {{sticker:sona-playing}} Rude. {{sticker:sg-janna}}
> [{quoted}](name=Psyconic hero,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=9oP3AB8U,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-01-03T10:04:13.402+0000) > > Rude. {{sticker:sg-janna}} How?
: Within all of this hate, what do you like about this game?
Cancerous as it is half of it for me is generally the community. Sometimes i met shinning diamonds and that's always nice and sometimes I meet some of the smelliest turds which...depending on how shitty they are in what way can be entertaining. The other half is just a promise to keep, addiction, or habit. Not leaning more on the 1st one more than anything.
: Kayn i think is bad too just not as bad as some of the others. Blue Kayn has way too many things when he evolves: 1) Extra W range 2) detached W 3) damage done as magic damage 4) Longer E duration 5) Faster movement during E 6) longer r activation range versus Red Kayn 1) Healing from spells 2) Q does % max hp damage 3) W knocks up. 4) R does % max hp damage. I think the amount of damage red kayn does is too strong and needs to be nerfed but he doesnt have as much extra stuff as blue kayn and kayn also has his skills cooldowns scaled too low. In my opinion red kayn should have gotten one of the w buffs and blue kayn shouldnt have had the longer e duration even if they got the e moves faster one.
> [{quoted}](name=LordGeovanni,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qeU4hprA,comment-id=00090001,timestamp=2018-12-30T01:34:23.554+0000) > > Kayn i think is bad too just not as bad as some of the others. Blue Kayn has way too many things when he evolves: > 1) Extra W range > 2) detached W > 3) damage done as magic damage > 4) Longer E duration > 5) Faster movement during E > 6) longer r activation range > versus Red Kayn > 1) Healing from spells > 2) Q does % max hp damage > 3) W knocks up. > 4) R does % max hp damage. > > I think the amount of damage red kayn does is too strong and needs to be nerfed but he doesnt have as much extra stuff as blue kayn and kayn also has his skills cooldowns scaled too low. > In my opinion red kayn should have gotten one of the w buffs and blue kayn shouldnt have had the longer e duration even if they got the e moves faster one. ...I'd just like to point out you say blue kayn gets way too much extra stuff, but everyone picks red more.
: > [{quoted}](name=Aseraan,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ni02AA2s,comment-id=0003000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-28T19:52:13.589+0000) > > And that already makes me feel like effin riven-. So by that logic, because Darius has an auto reset on his W, that should make me feel like I'm playing Jax or vice versa. Or because Urgot has a dash on his E that can't go over walls, that should make me feel like I'm playing Kled? That kind of reasoning just makes no sense.
> [{quoted}](name=SSJMike,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ni02AA2s,comment-id=00030000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-28T19:59:59.544+0000) > > So by that logic, because Darius has an auto reset on his W, that should make me feel like I'm playing Jax or vice versa. Or because Urgot has a dash on his E that can't go over walls, that should make me feel like I'm playing Kled? > > That kind of reasoning just makes no sense. I'd like to point out that his E is also a short dash like rivens.
LTK KoRo (EUW)
: If you want to blame anyone for current meta, blame ADCs and supports for the s7 ardent meta. Current meta is just a result of hatred towards enchanters and hypercarries (and it's rightful hatred, fuck these classes).
> [{quoted}](name=LTK KoRo,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qej25XBx,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2018-12-25T12:57:02.253+0000) > > If you want to blame anyone for current meta, blame ADCs and supports for the s7 ardent meta. Current meta is just a result of hatred towards enchanters and hypercarries (and it's rightful hatred, fuck these classes). You're half right-half wrong. The reason for THAT meta was...you guessed it assassin mains.
: Oracle's Alteration Should Not Activate Boxes.
1st and foremost no. This will buff shaco which no one wants. Also your traps need to be shown and triggered so people can simply back off from them and not risk a bunch of damage and with what this post seems to make it sound melees still wouldn't be able to do anything about them with the traps attacking and fearing.
Lilithh (NA)
: Sometimes, I wonder why Rioters no longer respond to us, but the answer has become more apparent.
I mean perhaps if they started doing their jobs better there'd be less of a witch hunt.
: Bethesda has fallen, and now Blizzard also has fallen
The 1st time I got burned by company similar to this was day break games when they split h1z1 into 2 games "just survive" and "king of the kill". Literally anyone who bought the game bought it for the survival game aspect. That's what we paid money for and after the split king of the kill was constantly getting updates and any money made from people buying the now split zombie survival aspect of it was having their money go into king of the kill. Just recently they shut down the survival part of the game to able to fully focus all efforts on king of the kill. That company fucking scammed thousands.
: So Evelynn's appearance would change based on a culture's perception of beauty?
I'm not a lore expert but to end the debate in the comments it is stated evelynn CAN change her form herself, but she chooses not to due to something about how difficult it is to perfect it.
y0r1ck (NA)
: Eh when it happens it's rarely enough to lose lane off of. I wouldn't call it a major bug, since I don't even see it that often. Using all caps like that just makes u look butthurt btw
> [{quoted}](name=y0r1ck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OLI81ILq,comment-id=00090000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-15T03:11:21.371+0000) > > Eh when it happens it's rarely enough to lose lane off of. I wouldn't call it a major bug, since I don't even see it that often. Using all caps like that just makes u look butthurt btw Uh no it makes sure that people get the point. Don't assume that because I caps'ed a few words people think I'm butthurt. It makes you look bad to say someone is butthurt when they bring up a valid point
y0r1ck (NA)
: These are known bugs.
> [{quoted}](name=y0r1ck,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OLI81ILq,comment-id=000900000000,timestamp=2018-12-15T01:37:18.377+0000) > > These are known bugs. Which stands to reason that it should be fixed. I ALWAYS notice when it happens. It is a MAJOR bug.
: He needs his ghouls to not take 1.75-2 seconds after being summoned to start moving and attacking.
> [{quoted}](name=LordGeovanni,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=OLI81ILq,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2018-12-15T00:39:16.337+0000) > > He needs his ghouls to not take 1.75-2 seconds after being summoned to start moving and attacking. They need to leap too on marked targets. Had an issue with marking not triggering the leap for no real reason.
Vlada Cut (EUNE)
: Plays good - I'm smurfing Doesn't do what teammates tell you - You're trolling Misses a cannon - I'm inting Says something - stfu kid Still tries to say something - kys Yup. Lovely community.
> [{quoted}](name=Vlada Cut,realm=EUNE,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Oa2kMEAs,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-13T20:15:14.746+0000) > > Plays good - I'm smurfing > Doean't do what teammates tell you - You're trolling > Misses a cannon - I'm inting > Says something - stfu kid > Still tries to say something - kys > Yup. Lovely community. To be fair when the person who is lifting then entire team on their back gives an order and people don't follow it despite lacking knowledge or skill to ignore his orders they ARE trolling. If I'm playing trynd, sion, darius or some other split pusher with a score of 5/1/1 and I say "all of you group bot and shove they have to pick yall or me" and you ignore that you're trolling.
Meritas (EUNE)
: And people complain when tank champions get compensated with Damage/more CC {{sticker:sg-kiko}}
> [{quoted}](name=Meritas,realm=EUNE,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=yBal9Z73,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-12-13T00:10:22.079+0000) > > And people complain when tank champions get compensated with Damage/more CC {{sticker:sg-kiko}} Right cause they're not TANKS any more. Like seriously we NEED to cut damage DOWN and BUFF tanks resistances.
: > [{quoted}](name=Kingfireblast,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sIpxcfxY,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-12-10T09:30:38.700+0000) > > I haven't played the game that long, but that is quite interesting. Transcendence gives you adaptive damage in return for that extra 20% and those items likely give other useful stats Hardly anything gave cdr so if you were playing a mage unless you wanted to build items that gave cdr with highly reduced ap and maybe no ap and some mana, standard builds gave 10-20% cdr max. Building 40% cdr on a mage was trolly at one point.....
> [{quoted}](name=videorfeak,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=sIpxcfxY,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-10T10:18:07.668+0000) > > Hardly anything gave cdr so if you were playing a mage unless you wanted to build items that gave cdr with highly reduced ap and maybe no ap and some mana, standard builds gave 10-20% cdr max. Building 40% cdr on a mage was trolly at one point..... Yha I remember that...unless you were something like teemo 40% CDR on decent (when I played and remember a .8 AP ratio on shrooms) Damage even with low AP and they lasted 10 minutes.
: I mean, I stomped Meddler in lane (7/0/1) and he is on the balance team....
> [{quoted}](name=demonicthomas,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Anb9l55t,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2018-12-10T02:26:25.767+0000) > > I mean, I stomped Meddler in lane (7/0/1) and he is on the balance team.... Did the champ you use get nerfed afterwards?
: League of Legends is not the game, I knew..
I've have been around this game for a very long time...Let me say this any true league player that's been here since about...season 3 at least will side with you. Those that don't are either generally very high elo (The game IS catered to them afterall), not likely a true league player (as this game went from being a 40+ minute game to a 15-25 minute game which few real league players would like), or just trolling you.
: Farewell Friends
Most of the rioters I met didn't know shit about how to play this game...you didn't miss much there. Only time I ever actually lost to one in drafts is when they were with pre-made with diamonds lol.
: Wait what was wrong with that comment? Seemed pretty reasonable
> [{quoted}](name=IcyPepper,realm=NA,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=o06teyL4,comment-id=000200000001,timestamp=2018-12-05T03:31:49.948+0000) > > Wait what was wrong with that comment? Seemed pretty reasonable Ula doesn't know what a witch hunt actually is.
: > [{quoted}](name=Vekkna,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=r2ycg0xv,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2018-12-04T23:38:44.900+0000) > {{champion:96}} attack speed and on-hit are more important {{champion:110}} attack speed and on-hit are more important {{champion:35}} lethality is more important; he does all physical damage anyway, except his boxes and r explosion {{champion:42}} I don't feel like doing the math, but I imagine gunblade gives him more scaling {{champion:120}} Tri, movement speed, and durability are more important {{champion:126}} lethality is more important; his only sources of magic damage are either minuscule (hammer w) or very infrequent (hammer switch passive) and thus it is only marginally more effective on him {{champion:11}} attack speed and on-hit are more important {{champion:77}} I don't know what's important for Udyr, since I see a different build every time trick is featured on synapse, but I don't think he ever builds any kind of offensive sustain {{champion:19}} durability, tiamat, and cdr are more important; 15% omnivamp probably won't save him from anything that his innate sustain can't save him from --- #The real DD abusers will be those who are already abusing conq
> [{quoted}](name=ez mental boom,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=r2ycg0xv,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2018-12-04T23:48:17.908+0000) > > {{champion:96}} attack speed and on-hit are more important > > {{champion:110}} attack speed and on-hit are more important > > {{champion:35}} lethality is more important; he does all physical damage anyway, except his boxes and r explosion > > {{champion:42}} I don't feel like doing the math, but I imagine gunblade gives him more scaling > > {{champion:120}} Tri, movement speed, and durability are more important > > {{champion:126}} lethality is more important; his only sources of magic damage are either minuscule (hammer w) or very infrequent (hammer switch passive) and thus it is only marginally more effective on him > > {{champion:11}} attack speed and on-hit are more important > > {{champion:77}} I don't know what's important for Udyr, since I see a different build every time trick is featured on synapse, but I don't think he ever builds any kind of offensive sustain > > {{champion:19}} durability, tiamat, and cdr are more important; 15% omnivamp probably won't save him from anything that his innate sustain can't save him from > --- > #The real DD abusers will be those who are already abusing conq I favor Bork on udyr honestly.
Maelrus (EUW)
: Thats why we can now get 45% pseudo spell vamp with Gunblade, DD and Rav Hunter
> [{quoted}](name=Maelrus,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=r2ycg0xv,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-04T20:49:51.238+0000) > > Thats why we can now get 45% pseudo spell vamp with Gunblade, DD and Rav Hunter Throw in Spirit visage.
: > [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=000000030000,timestamp=2018-12-04T01:53:25.807+0000) > > Probably like this: *I feel that the individual may have tried to hard to make the board into his/her vision of the board, rather than more fully embracing the desires of the community. I would have liked to see more attention paid to asking about the community vision.* > > It's not only better feedback that provides a clearer direction for desired changes, but it also avoids accusing the individual of seizing power or going mad with power. Listen, more detailed, explicit thoughts with clear intent are always better... but you've seen these boards. Plenty of people are dropping 1-2 sentences and moving on with their day, not everyone is writing these detailed posts. You wrote 46 words as a replacement to one word. And I don't think its honest to how the OP felt. Even if they didn't intend disrespect "Madman"/"Mad with power" both are turns of phrase that have a negative connotation for a reason. Its to imply something went horribly wrong, if we're expected to write a fluff piece every time we want to have criticism even if its a vague/short comment then you'll just see a lot less posts on the boards overall. You may be right that it's more useful feedback, but the OP made a one off comment about how he felt about a dedicated moderator and how well it worked. It was simple and to the point, it doesn't need to be any more or less than what he wrote. It clearly was negative, but classifying it as abuse when abuse is typically Hate Speech or prolonged, targeted harassment is an absurd stretch. If we're getting so hung up over one word that's not even that loaded of a term then we clearly need more explicit rules for the boards because if we're expected to not type things like what the OP did a lot of posters are breaking the expectations of board users. Hell he even wrote "Kinda a madman", he intentionally lightened the statement as he posted it because he knew it was hyperbole.
> [{quoted}](name=TwitchInMyPants,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0000000300000000,timestamp=2018-12-04T02:20:48.398+0000) > > Listen, more detailed, explicit thoughts with clear intent are always better... but you've seen these boards. Plenty of people are dropping 1-2 sentences and moving on with their day, not everyone is writing these detailed posts. You wrote 46 words as a replacement to one word. And I don't think its honest to how the OP felt. > > Even if they didn't intend disrespect "Madman"/"Mad with power" both are turns of phrase that have a negative connotation for a reason. Its to imply something went horribly wrong, if we're expected to write a fluff piece every time we want to have criticism even if its a vague/short comment then you'll just see a lot less posts on the boards overall. You may be right that it's more useful feedback, but the OP made a one off comment about how he felt about a dedicated moderator and how well it worked. It was simple and to the point, it doesn't need to be any more or less than what he wrote. > > It clearly was negative, but classifying it as abuse when abuse is typically Hate Speech or prolonged, targeted harassment is an absurd stretch. If we're getting so hung up over one word that's not even that loaded of a term then we clearly need more explicit rules for the boards because if we're expected to not type things like what the OP did a lot of posters are breaking the expectations of board users. > > Hell he even wrote "Kinda a madman", he intentionally lightened the statement as he posted it because he knew it was hyperbole. Can I just say thank you for explaining to djinn how the boards are about the way they post short, but to the point type of statements. If anyone wants extra info on the subject they'd ask for it, and as the original poster of the comment it would look rude of me not to reply to it. Those that know what I meant would either agree or disagree on the spot, and those who lack knowledge on what happened and want certain details would ask. Not everyone can/will take the time to read a wall of text on these boards and in my experience if you want to get points across to people generally you need to use very short easy to understand sentences.
: > [{quoted}](name=Cynicatt,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=00000000000100000004,timestamp=2018-12-04T10:59:25.781+0000) > > Dude, I have no idea who the guy is talking about in that comment, and I guess that might just be me, but you're seeing it from the angle you want to see it from. > There's absolutely no mention of anyone's name, and there's definitely no mention of anybody's mental health. He just said "power mad", which would be easily interchangeable with something like "power hungry". Would "power hungry" still have offended you? > You're really coming across like you're giving special treatment to your friends because you only perceived that an insult was present and decided to punish, when in reality it was more of a passive remark. > > Before I left GD(which was after community mods, and you guys still have the same rules) I had plenty of comments directed at me that were REAL personal attacks and ACTUAL insults that were not removed(some of which came from a community mod himself), so it's just obnoxious to see this, you understand. You guys have been extra sensitive for your friends since this whole thing started and couldn't care less about the posters outside of your friend groups. > > And I get you're probably not gonna read or agree with this because I'm not a mod, and I'm not trying to launch a personal attack against you either, it's just an issue that has been present with the mod team since community mods started. This is context that I referred to in my previous comment. At the time the comment was made, in reply to another user, it was pretty obvious who he was talking about. I don't expect you to understand. But I will say that I think it's very misleading for the OP to pretend like that isn't part of the conversation. Again, if I'm wrong about that, I have made more than one offer for the OP to clear up the mistake. He hasn't, and I think the obvious implication is that he cannot. All the mods that have seen the comment have agreed that removal was 100% warranted; that much has not been up for debate among *any* of the people (other than the OP) who can see the full context.
> [{quoted}](name=KnightsKemplar,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=000000000001000000040001,timestamp=2018-12-04T15:53:15.333+0000) > > This is context that I referred to in my previous comment. > > At the time the comment was made, in reply to another user, it was pretty obvious who he was talking about. I don't expect you to understand. But I will say that I think it's very misleading for the OP to pretend like that isn't part of the conversation. > > Again, if I'm wrong about that, I have made more than one offer for the OP to clear up the mistake. He hasn't, and I think the obvious implication is that he cannot. All the mods that have seen the comment have agreed that removal was 100% warranted; that much has not been up for debate among *any* of the people (other than the OP) who can see the full context. The post I commented on was deleted, so I may have to paraphrase what I remember. The post had the individual asking for heavier moderation on M+G asking for 2 things that stand out to me that I recall. The desire to have mods come in and remove "low-quality content" from M+G. The desire to have mods show up and remove threads that don't belong in M+G. My statement on the matter was referencing the fact the last time we had a dedicated mod to do these things in M+G (someone who would know the culture of M+G well much similar to the Ambassador role helping with GD culture) they ended up removing what they alone (from what I recall of the incident) considered to be low quality content when a massive chunk of vocal part in the post about it was saying that to them this was quality content. Now in and of it-self that action wasn't terrible, but this is where it began. After receiving MUCH feed back from the community on the post about something being "low quality" they opted to 1.Argue with everyone in the thread about if it was low quality and if I recall correctly in a not so...professional manner from what I recall. 2.Locked the thread while discussion was still going on about their actions and how they were all unhappy that the mod basically decided that it wasn't a good joke and therefore warranted removal without a chance to repost it when the COMMUNITY was requesting they let the individual repost it. 3.They did not apologize for any of their actions until AFTER their mods perms had been removed. It is fine to have a request to come sweep M+G of things that literally do NOT belong there more often almost any mod can do that and be highly accurate, but when you start touching on jokes that are not an insult or otherwise to anyone and basically deciding what counts as "low quality content" you start stepping over some lines there. As for "in reply to another user" you make it sound like we're not allowed to reply in certain ways to certain people...which would count as favoritism. If the ex-mod sees that and people still remember what they've done that doesn't warrant you removing a statement of the past just cause you think their feelings are going to get hurt if they see it. That comment wasn't an attack on anyone. It was a legit remark about the past and the concern that it could happen again easily. An attack for all intents and purposes would be saying the person in question was an asshole, or a full on derp without any clue what their job was after they left the team. All that was stated was facts that they went too far with the power they had and lost it due to that reason.
: > [{quoted}](name=iamthegoatofwar,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=00070000,timestamp=2018-12-04T09:53:33.535+0000) > > Thanks eve. I do agree that perhaps this should be brought to more people's attention to make sure shit like this never happens again. That's the whole point of why I made another post about it. It's hard to get mistakes to never be repeated again for the remainder of human history. That's a huge ask. But we can do our best to make certain the same mistakes aren't repeated by the same individuals over and over. That's a pretty easy ask and a goal we can strive for.
> [{quoted}](name=oOBestEveNAOo,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=000700000000,timestamp=2018-12-04T18:06:22.339+0000) > > It's hard to get mistakes to never be repeated again for the remainder of human history. That's a huge ask. But we can do our best to make certain the same mistakes aren't repeated by the same individuals over and over. That's a pretty easy ask and a goal we can strive for. That's generally what I had meant with that statement eve. An example of what NOT to do in this case. Ensure that the frequency of it happening would drop massively.
Ruanter (NA)
: the ultimate plan
The memes have begun...
Terozu (NA)
: Tonberry champ concept, for every kill you have his ultimate does 100 true damage to u.
> [{quoted}](name=Terozu,realm=NA,application-id=Ir7ZrJjF,discussion-id=uTK8xBUQ,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-12-04T04:37:01.121+0000) > > Tonberry champ concept, for every kill you have his ultimate does 100 true damage to u. ...you're legit onto something that's an interesting thought to play around with similar to garen's villain mechanic.
Cynicatt (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=KnightsKemplar,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0000000000010000,timestamp=2018-12-04T01:06:44.399+0000) > > The designation of why is was removed isn't always a big concern for me. When I think someone is getting harassed, the other party is being a jerk *and* having an inappropriate discussion (potentially). If the penalties for that were significantly different, that distinction would matter a lot. As it stands, I think that's splitting hairs. > > As I've explained elsewhere, I removed that because I thought, in the moment, that it was an intentional attack against a user. That is well within the purview for removal. The removal was not necessarily predicated on the fact that we're talking about abuse; Ulan may have reasoned that way, but that's not why I removed it. > > I'm always game for discussing abuse of mod power. I think it's really important. I do not, though, see the value in using insults about a *past* moderators mental health. Calling someone mad is an insult. I don't have a high tolerance for insults, in particular, that seem to suggest that someone has a mental health issue. I think that's a touchy subject that we don't need to get into. That's why i removed it. > Dude, I have no idea who the guy is talking about in that comment, and I guess that might just be me, but you're seeing it from the angle you want to see it from. There's absolutely no mention of anyone's name, and there's definitely no mention of anybody's mental health. He just said "power mad", which would be easily interchangeable with something like "power hungry". Would "power hungry" still have offended you? You're really coming across like you're giving special treatment to your friends because you only perceived that an insult was present and decided to punish, when in reality it was more of a passive remark. Before I left GD(which was after community mods, and you guys still have the same rules) I had plenty of comments directed at me that were REAL personal attacks and ACTUAL insults that were not removed(some of which came from a community mod himself), so it's just obnoxious to see this, you understand. You guys have been extra sensitive for your friends since this whole thing started and couldn't care less about the posters outside of your friend groups. And I get you're probably not gonna read or agree with this because I'm not a mod, and I'm not trying to launch a personal attack against you either, it's just an issue that has been present with the mod team since community mods started.
> [{quoted}](name=Cynicatt,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=00000000000100000004,timestamp=2018-12-04T10:59:25.781+0000) > > Dude, I have no idea who the guy is talking about in that comment, and I guess that might just be me, but you're seeing it from the angle you want to see it from. > There's absolutely no mention of anyone's name, and there's definitely no mention of anybody's mental health. He just said "power mad", which would be easily interchangeable with something like "power hungry". Would "power hungry" still have offended you? > You're really coming across like you're giving special treatment to your friends because you only perceived that an insult was present and decided to punish, when in reality it was more of a passive remark. > > Before I left GD(which was after community mods, and you guys still have the same rules) I had plenty of comments directed at me that were REAL personal attacks and ACTUAL insults that were not removed(some of which came from a community mod himself), so it's just obnoxious to see this, you understand. You guys have been extra sensitive for your friends since this whole thing started and couldn't care less about the posters outside of your friend groups. > > And I get you're probably not gonna read or agree with this because I'm not a mod, and I'm not trying to launch a personal attack against you either, it's just an issue that has been present with the mod team since community mods started. A large part of the reason why I believe the community mods became a thing is cause when the reds made mistakes moderating their jobs could quickly be in serious danger. It's not a stable position to be in at all. If they did say fire most of the ones willing to directly be responsible for it then your next viable option would be volunteers. This is merely my guess however. As for him not reading your post all I have to say is on an issue like this with extreme levels of community disapproval for his action not taking the time to at least glance (doesn't need to reply to everything) would be highly disrespectful. Also on the power mad becoming power hungry swap to me (not text book definition just opinion) power hungry sounds quite a bit more...disrespectful for some reason. I can't place WHY, but it does. Like I think that saying one went power mad didn't mean that they lusted for more and more power, they just made some extremely massive mistakes with what they had, where as saying power hungry makes it sound like they're willing to do damn near anything to ensure that what they say goes and can not be contested whatsoever while just trying to climb more and more to get away with more and more. This however would just be my opinion on why power hungry would have felt far more disrespectful however. Some people probably would have different ones.
: Honestly thought ur statement was pretty fine. You didn't mention the person and only the people who already know who it is know what you're reffering to. Not disrespectful at all. I said something way worse and got it removed for disrespectful but didn't get a punishment. I'm thankful, but this is kinda unfair. I literally called the person and idiot. this is what I said: HEY IDIOTS. She's getting buffed IN THE NEW GAME MODE. NOT SUMMONERS RIFT. You can go back to being idiots that don't do your research and fall for clickbait now. the context was people were complaining about Akali buffs when she was only getting buffed in that clash gamemode... with every other assassin. I seirously don't understand how you calling someone power mad is bad at all. I feel as if you would have to be very sensitive to remove a comment like that. I've seen much worse things being said on the boards without any action taken. This makes me feel like the judgement level between each moderator is a little to big. If that's the case it just becomes like a gamble of hope only the "cool" moderator sees this. Imo mods should get together and talk about what's acceptable and what isn't because what you said is completely ok in my eyes. Like if someone said that about me after I was a mod and mabye lost that mod by going power crazy, I wouldn't be offended. Like you said it in a normal non agressive way that just kind of got the situation across. Imo, I don't understand why this guy's comment was punished and it makes me uneasy. It really blurs the lines of what's ok and what isn't. People should be getting punished for homophobic phrases, racism, targeted hate, etc. Not this.
> [{quoted}](name=The Trent,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2018-12-04T10:35:56.302+0000) > > Honestly thought ur statement was pretty fine. You didn't mention the person and only the people who already know who it is know what you're reffering to. Not disrespectful at all. I said something way worse and got it removed for disrespectful but didn't get a punishment. I'm thankful, but this is kinda unfair. I literally called the person and idiot. > > this is what I said: HEY IDIOTS. She's getting buffed IN THE NEW GAME MODE. NOT SUMMONERS RIFT. You can go back to being idiots that don't do your research and fall for clickbait now. > > the context was people were complaining about Akali buffs when she was only getting buffed in that clash gamemode... with every other assassin. I seirously don't understand how you calling someone power mad is bad at all. I feel as if you would have to be very sensitive to remove a comment like that. I've seen much worse things being said on the boards without any action taken. This makes me feel like the judgement level between each moderator is a little to big. If that's the case it just becomes like a gamble of hope only the "cool" moderator sees this. Imo mods should get together and talk about what's acceptable and what isn't because what you said is completely ok in my eyes. Like if someone said that about me after I was a mod and mabye lost that mod by going power crazy, I wouldn't be offended. Like you said it in a normal non agressive way that just kind of got the situation across. Imo, I don't understand why this guy's comment was punished and it makes me uneasy. It really blurs the lines of what's ok and what isn't. People should be getting punished for homophobic phrases, racism, targeted hate, etc. Not this. I get what you're saying and if I might reference your removal I have said FAR worse things without punishment, and logically knowing that if I wanted to be ass about this statement I made about past moderation I would have. I got a very solid point about something that was legitimate concern in less than 20 words in (my opinion at least) the most polite way possible. I'll admit I can't promise the ex-mod won't see the statement. Nothing I can do would prevent that. But when you abuse power so badly that people remember your actions (even if the people involved like myself) can't recall the names, but recall the actions they took VERY CLEARLY on what they did that's on them. They left that mark on the league boards history, be it good or bad.
: So, I'm getting to this late, but let me go ahead and address the situation. First and foremost, the modifications of the rules on the boards in relation to posts condemning Riot staff or volunteer staff seem like reasonable enough updates to the rules at face value. Secondly. and equally important, is the fact that this update to the rules has not been well communicated in the community at large. When rules that fundamentally change the way the forums operate are put into place these rules need to be communicated in a much better fashion so that the information can be properly assimilated by the community, and there needs to be a well communicated grace period in which to make the transition. These things were not done in this particular matter. Sure, I know about the changes because I associate with our volunteer staff, but the average forum goer will not. And just like the OP of this thread I only found out when something I posted was removed. This should not be the case, these changes should be made with very clear notification of the update to the community at large and in a way that immediately brings attention to the changes to any person who may be using the boards for the first time or after a long absence. Thirdly, any punishment for the post made by the OP is a grave error on the part of the volunteer staff. Nothing about that post warrants anything other than a removal and to notify the OP of the rules changes and why his post was removed. The fact the post was made is NOT an error on the part of the OP, but an error on the part of our boards staff for failing to properly communicate a FUNDAMENTAL change in the rules for the boards. Fourthly, and as I've already spoken with Jikker about in some detail, former moderators are NOT included in the change to these rules as a former mod no longer holds an official position and would, thus, fall under the rules regarding "public figures" within the community. Currently, as the rules stand, discussion of the activities and negative commenting in relation to "public figures" is very much allowed. Fifthly, as I already mentioned to Jikker, and as I'm sure she'll be bringing up with you guys on the vol staff in the near future or may have already done, the change to the rules needs to ALSO include "public figures" to clean up this kind of mess. As it stands at the moment the current rules changes are a failure on two fronts: One, it creates a double standard for those who hold official positions but does nothing to cover public figures such as Hashinshin, Tyler1, or Laughing Fish, which is an unacceptable double standard that will lead to MORE confusing issues such as what required the creation of this post. And two, because the changes were very poorly communicated and disseminated among the public some serious thought and consideration needs to be given to HOW to notify the board using public at large that the rules have been modified moving forward and this notification needs to happen visibly for the next month or so. Sixth, some consideration needs to be given to when the line of free speech is being unduly crossed. It's a principal which this community is founded on, just as many in the world are founded on it. People should be allowed to post what's on their minds in relation to any topic provided it is done so respectfully. It could be said that the OP's post was an "attack" on an individual. It could also be said it was a light-hearted and satirical recollection of historical events used to highlight a need for something. There's a lot to unpack in the post the OP made and nothing about it seems overly rude, merely critical. And criticism, particularly valid criticism, is something we probably don't want to censor. Going down that road leads to very dark things and we do NOT want the reputation of being the "toxic community that silences any and all critics". I rather think Reddit is doing enough of that and I'd prefer they keep that evil to themselves and not on our board. And lastly, OP, if you need any assistance with this matter feel free to reach out to me on the boards and I'll get in touch with some of the volunteers to discuss the situation in as much detail as I can with them. I don't hold any official position, and would decline any offered to me, but my length of involvement within this community is basically second to none and because of that my opinions on various topics still occasionally holds merit with our most veteran members. I can't promise any discussion I might have on your behalf would change anything, but I can pretty much promise that discussion will reach ears enough to make certain things that can be handled better in the future will be better handled.
> [{quoted}](name=oOBestEveNAOo,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0007,timestamp=2018-12-04T05:07:30.063+0000) > > So, I'm getting to this late, but let me go ahead and address the situation. > > First and foremost, the modifications of the rules on the boards in relation to posts condemning Riot staff or volunteer staff seem like reasonable enough updates to the rules at face value. > > Secondly. and equally important, is the fact that this update to the rules has not been well communicated in the community at large. When rules that fundamentally change the way the forums operate are put into place these rules need to be communicated in a much better fashion so that the information can be properly assimilated by the community, and there needs to be a well communicated grace period in which to make the transition. These things were not done in this particular matter. Sure, I know about the changes because I associate with our volunteer staff, but the average forum goer will not. And just like the OP of this thread I only found out when something I posted was removed. This should not be the case, these changes should be made with very clear notification of the update to the community at large and in a way that immediately brings attention to the changes to any person who may be using the boards for the first time or after a long absence. > > Thirdly, any punishment for the post made by the OP is a grave error on the part of the volunteer staff. Nothing about that post warrants anything other than a removal and to notify the OP of the rules changes and why his post was removed. The fact the post was made is NOT an error on the part of the OP, but an error on the part of our boards staff for failing to properly communicate a FUNDAMENTAL change in the rules for the boards. > > Fourthly, and as I've already spoken with Jikker about in some detail, former moderators are NOT included in the change to these rules as a former mod no longer holds an official position and would, thus, fall under the rules regarding "public figures" within the community. Currently, as the rules stand, discussion of the activities and negative commenting in relation to "public figures" is very much allowed. > > Fifthly, as I already mentioned to Jikker, and as I'm sure she'll be bringing up with you guys on the vol staff in the near future or may have already done, the change to the rules needs to ALSO include "public figures" to clean up this kind of mess. As it stands at the moment the current rules changes are a failure on two fronts: One, it creates a double standard for those who hold official positions but does nothing to cover public figures such as Hashinshin, Tyler1, or Laughing Fish, which is an unacceptable double standard that will lead to MORE confusing issues such as what required the creation of this post. And two, because the changes were very poorly communicated and disseminated among the public some serious thought and consideration needs to be given to HOW to notify the board using public at large that the rules have been modified moving forward and this notification needs to happen visibly for the next month or so. > > Sixth, some consideration needs to be given to when the line of free speech is being unduly crossed. It's a principal which this community is founded on, just as many in the world are founded on it. People should be allowed to post what's on their minds in relation to any topic provided it is done so respectfully. It could be said that the OP's post was an "attack" on an individual. It could also be said it was a light-hearted and satirical recollection of historical events used to highlight a need for something. There's a lot to unpack in the post the OP made and nothing about it seems overly rude, merely critical. And criticism, particularly valid criticism, is something we probably don't want to censor. Going down that road leads to very dark things and we do NOT want the reputation of being the "toxic community that silences any and all critics". I rather think Reddit is doing enough of that and I'd prefer they keep that evil to themselves and not on our board. > > And lastly, OP, if you need any assistance with this matter feel free to reach out to me on the boards and I'll get in touch with some of the volunteers to discuss the situation in as much detail as I can with them. I don't hold any official position, and would decline any offered to me, but my length of involvement within this community is basically second to none and because of that my opinions on various topics still occasionally holds merit with our most veteran members. I can't promise any discussion I might have on your behalf would change anything, but I can pretty much promise that discussion will reach ears enough to make certain things that can be handled better in the future will be better handled. Thanks eve. I do agree that perhaps this should be brought to more people's attention to make sure shit like this never happens again. That's the whole point of why I made another post about it.
Shiƒter (NA)
: When your lane opponent is a lore matchup
: The designation of why is was removed isn't always a big concern for me. When I think someone is getting harassed, the other party is being a jerk *and* having an inappropriate discussion (potentially). If the penalties for that were significantly different, that distinction would matter a lot. As it stands, I think that's splitting hairs. As I've explained elsewhere, I removed that because I thought, in the moment, that it was an intentional attack against a user. That is well within the purview for removal. The removal was not necessarily predicated on the fact that we're talking about abuse; Ulan may have reasoned that way, but that's not why I removed it. I'm always game for discussing abuse of mod power. I think it's really important. I do not, though, see the value in using insults about a *past* moderators mental health. Calling someone mad is an insult. I don't have a high tolerance for insults, in particular, that seem to suggest that someone has a mental health issue. I think that's a touchy subject that we don't need to get into. That's why i removed it. As for my agreement with Djinn, I have a *long* history (at this point) of mutual respect. When he has a differing opinion from me, I pay attention, because I think Djinn has a lot of good ideas, even if I don't always agree with him. It doesn't offend me to be told I was little over-aggressive with that removal. I have taken that opinion under advisement so I can serve you guys better in the future. I retain the opinion that when we think there's a danger of continued harassment, a short ban is a good precautionary measure, so that the person has to come talk to us and we can make sure there's a mutual understanding before they can spam another 50 insults. That may not have been the case here, and, if presented with a similar situation in the future, I'll definitely be more careful about jumping straight to a ban. Does that alleviate some of your concern?
"I retain the opinion that when we think there's a danger of continued harassment" I'm busy at the moment and can't fully scan all this, but given how I have no history of doing this I would say this statement is invalid in this situation. "that seem to suggest that someone has a mental health issue"...my statement didn't at all suggest they had a mental health issue however?
: > [{quoted}](name=iamthegoatofwar,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0000000100000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:44:11.938+0000)Your mod hand waved...every...single...person in that thread with that statement. So, one point -- Kemp is a Herald like myself. He's not *my* mod. That said, I do think that message could have been significantly improved. As I said, none of us really pretend to be perfect. >I'm not even getting an apology from him when he made this very clear mistake about what he did to me, and he owes EVERYONE in that thread be it on my side or his with that remark. That's ultimately between you and him. I can't make him do anything, and if he feels an apology is appropriate he may make one or not. That said, from my perspective it's a bit frustrating that every mistake we make -- small or large -- is held up as examples of us being power-hungry or incompetent, when in reality it's simply something that *will* happen with *any* team when you deal with as many reports and as much content as we deal with. Given the hundreds of reports that come through each day, our accuracy rate is actually pretty damn high, and while I acknowledge that it's really frustrating to be on the receiving end of an overzealous action it sometimes feels like people are unwilling to meet us half way or appreciate that there are a lot of completely appropriate and legitimate removals that *don't* appear on the boards.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=00000001000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:50:58.583+0000) > > So, one point -- Kemp is a Herald like myself. He's not *my* mod. That said, I do think that message could have been significantly improved. As I said, none of us really pretend to be perfect. > > That's ultimately between you and him. I can't make him do anything, and if he feels an apology is appropriate he may make one or not. > > That said, from my perspective it's a bit frustrating that every mistake we make -- small or large -- is held up as examples of us being power-hungry or incompetent, when in reality it's simply something that *will* happen with *any* team when you deal with as many reports and as much content as we deal with. Given the hundreds of reports that come through each day, our accuracy rate is actually pretty damn high, and while I acknowledge that it's really frustrating to be on the receiving end of an overzealous action it sometimes feels like people are unwilling to meet us half way or appreciate that there are a lot of completely appropriate and legitimate removals that *don't* appear on the boards. I try to meet you as much as possible however it is things like this that happen that clearly shouldn't that draw attention to it. I also understand that he is not "your mod" but the only way we as a community can do anything about your actions is to rely on you to moderate each other.
Lenn (NA)
: i don't think the content should have been removed and definitely not punished the only thing i can say in the defense of it is that you could say it's targeted in that it's pretty obvious who you would be talking about, but i think discussion of moderation should be allowed even if it pertains to a specific moderator or ex-moderator, especially if you don't specifically name names
> [{quoted}](name=Lenn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:44:58.938+0000) > > i don't think the content should have been removed and definitely not punished > > the only thing i can say in the defense of it is that you could say it's targeted in that it's pretty obvious who you would be talking about, but i think discussion of moderation should be allowed even if it pertains to a specific moderator or ex-moderator, especially if you don't specifically name names It was on a post about asking for more moderation in the future on a section of the boards which made the comment completely relevant to the conversation.
: > [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:22:38.311+0000) > > You have a thread on this on **Discuss the Boards**, which is a better place to discuss the matter. Ultimately, public opinion on GD does not solely determine whether or not a punishment is appropriate, and we much prefer that you not open multiple threads on the same topic, especially when the other has a fairly robust discussion going. > > That said, my own opinion is that the removal is justified, but that the punishment was unnecessary. I think that a request to express your complaints in a more respectful manner would have sufficed. Honestly it shouldn't even have been removed. Chances are he wasn't the one derailing the topic. He didn't make a topic concerning it in an unrelated forum, this looks like a comment. ~~If you think that~~ his post did not deserve removal let alone punishment ~~you're more of a joke than~~ and the mod who did ban him is a joke. Alright looking over your responses you're pretty good in my book. Consider the remark retracted.
> [{quoted}](name=Theorchero,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=00000002,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:43:52.989+0000) > > Honestly it shouldn't even have been removed. Chances are he wasn't the one derailing the topic. He didn't make a topic concerning it in an unrelated forum, this looks like a comment. > > If you think that his post deserved removal let alone punishment you're more of a joke than the mod who did ban him. May I politely ask you leave the insults away from djinn? He's one of the few mods I've personally interacted with somewhat heavily and he's alright?
: > [{quoted}](name=iamthegoatofwar,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:33:06.154+0000)...but here I'd say the fact the community as a whole and even you yourself said the punishment was not needed means something that shouldn't have happened here did. Sure! The unfortunate reality of moderation, however, is that we *won't* be 100% perfect all the time. In this case an appropriate removal came with a punishment that was too severe, but -- because we're a volunteer team and don't operate 24-7 -- we couldn't address it before the punishment expired. I'm sorry for the inconvenience, but there isn't much we can do now *other* than acknowledge that this punishment was a bit over-aggressive and keep an eye out for that in situations like this going forward.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:35:45.734+0000) > > Sure! The unfortunate reality of moderation, however, is that we *won't* be 100% perfect all the time. In this case an appropriate removal came with a punishment that was too severe, but -- because we're a volunteer team and don't operate 24-7 -- we couldn't address it before the punishment expired. I'm sorry for the inconvenience, but there isn't much we can do now *other* than acknowledge that this punishment was a bit over-aggressive and keep an eye out for that in situations like this going forward. "Without context, I wouldn't expect very many people to feel that removal was warranted. I, however, do know the context, and it's part of good moderation not to be easily bamboozled out of doing the right thing. If you have a real argument to make, I'm happy to hear it." Your mod hand waved...every...single...person in that thread with that statement. I'm not even getting an apology from him when he made this very clear mistake about what he did to me, and he owes EVERYONE in that thread be it on my side or his with that remark.
CLG ear (NA)
: i don't think u should've been moderated
> [{quoted}](name=CLG ear,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:22:58.238+0000) > > i don't think u should've been moderated Thanks ear. Good to see you here.
Cynicatt (NA)
: I felt like I was missing context, so I went to your other thread to get that context, and even in context this is a ridiculous removal. This aint minority report, mods shouldn't be removing comments because of discussions that _MIGHT_ take place after the fact. Damn if they didn't prove the point of the removed post by removing it.
> [{quoted}](name=Cynicatt,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:30:17.693+0000) > > I felt like I was missing context, so I went to your other thread to get that context, and even in context this is a ridiculous removal. > This aint minority report, mods shouldn't be removing comments because of discussions that _MIGHT_ take place after the fact. > Damn if they didn't prove the point of the removed post by removing it. It is sadly starting to push towards that point. That's why I'm trying to get visibility on it.
: You have a thread on this on **Discuss the Boards**, which is a better place to discuss the matter. Ultimately, public opinion on GD does not solely determine whether or not a punishment is appropriate, and we much prefer that you not open multiple threads on the same topic, especially when the other has a fairly robust discussion going. That said, my own opinion is that the removal is justified, but that the punishment was unnecessary. I think that a request to express your complaints in a more respectful manner would have sufficed.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=Qpbjz8F7,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-12-03T22:22:38.311+0000) > > You have a thread on this on **Discuss the Boards**, which is a better place to discuss the matter. Ultimately, public opinion on GD does not solely determine whether or not a punishment is appropriate, and we much prefer that you not open multiple threads on the same topic, especially when the other has a fairly robust discussion going. > > That said, my own opinion is that the removal is justified, but that the punishment was unnecessary. I think that a request to express your complaints in a more respectful manner would have sufficed. While I will thank you for your opinion on the matter I'd say I've done nothing, but tried to be at least somewhat respectful towards everyone there. As for saying "public opinion on GD does not solely determine whether or not a punishment is appropriate" I won't say you're completely incorrect, but here I'd say the fact the community as a whole and even you yourself said the punishment was not needed means something that shouldn't have happened here did.
Rioter Comments
: > [{quoted}](name=Colonel J,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003d,timestamp=2018-12-03T20:43:39.905+0000)I know for a fact that we can call current mods powermad without punishment. I'd prefer that people voice their criticisms in more actionable ways (especially because if we see anyone being "power mad" we're going to have *very* strict words with them), but yes -- we allow a bit more leeway for the current moderation team because we're putting ourselves in a position where that is common and where frustrations may run high. When someone leaves that role, however, they're one again a normal community member for *most* purposes. I'm fine with respectful critique of a moderator's moderation style or a list of things you'd have liked to see them do better, but insulting someone at that point isn't something I think is appropriate. In short, this would be fine: "The Djinn wasn't really the best fit for the Herald role, I think. I found his rulings a little draconian, and would have liked him to ease up a bit on X, Y, and Z." This would not be: "The Djinn was a power-mad tyrant who only cared about throwing around his own weight. I'm glad he's gone."
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003d0000,timestamp=2018-12-03T20:58:45.395+0000) > > I'd prefer that people voice their criticisms in more actionable ways (especially because if we see anyone being "power mad" we're going to have *very* strict words with them), but yes -- we allow a bit more leeway for the current moderation team because we're putting ourselves in a position where that is common and where frustrations may run high. > > When someone leaves that role, however, they're one again a normal community member for *most* purposes. I'm fine with respectful critique of a moderator's moderation style or a list of things you'd have liked to see them do better, but insulting someone at that point isn't something I think is appropriate. > > In short, this would be fine: > > "The Djinn wasn't really the best fit for the Herald role, I think. I found his rulings a little draconian, and would have liked him to ease up a bit on X, Y, and Z." > > This would not be: > > "The Djinn was a power-mad tyrant who only cared about throwing around his own weight. I'm glad he's gone." But...at that point since you'd be a normal community member at that point that would fall under the name and shame wouldn't it?
: > [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003700000000000000000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:54:59.541+0000) > > We did, yes. It was in both the Universal Rules update and the post announcing the Universal Rules update, which was globally pinned for some time. Must have missed that then.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=00370000000000000000000100000000000000000000000000000002,timestamp=2018-12-03T20:08:18.442+0000) > > Because we can't hook on to that element without actually deleting a comment belonging to that individual, sadly. :( ...I Don't have access to your plans for updates to the boards but that might need to get bumped up priority wise so you can basically ensure people have a much higher chance of noticing something that major. Just a bit of feed back from me on that.
: Removal was justified, I don't agree the ban was.
> [{quoted}](name=Eleshakai,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003b,timestamp=2018-12-03T20:05:38.650+0000) > > Removal was justified, I don't agree the ban was. You're not the 1st one I've seen to give this answer...I thank you for commenting, but I'm curious as to why people are saying the one action was justified when it was legit statement regarding previous moderation on a post that could influence future moderation actions.
: > [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003700000000000000000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:54:59.541+0000) > > We did, yes. It was in both the Universal Rules update and the post announcing the Universal Rules update, which was globally pinned for some time. Must have missed that then.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=00370000000000000000000100000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T20:01:16.409+0000) > > No worries! It's about the best method we have of making announcements, sadly. I'll kill for the ability to put a pop-up window on the boards -- it would pretty much NEVER be used, but I'd like to have it to announce rule updates or super important announcements. why not use the Notification icon for when posts get removed ect? In most cases people don't ignore that I'd figure.
: > [{quoted}](name=iamthegoatofwar,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=00370000000000000000000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:50:51.033+0000) > > Did you guys ever really publicly address that you're tightening up on that stuff? Feels like it might be important for the community to know that something like that has changed. We did, yes. It was in both the Universal Rules update and the post announcing the Universal Rules update, which was globally pinned for some time.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003700000000000000000001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:54:59.541+0000) > > We did, yes. It was in both the Universal Rules update and the post announcing the Universal Rules update, which was globally pinned for some time. Must have missed that then.
: > [{quoted}](name=iamthegoatofwar,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003700000000000000000001000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:46:47.543+0000)Wait the community wanted these words banned? Am I understanding that correctly or was that a misunderstanding? We saw a lot of feedback requesting that, yes. That feedback -- combined with the fact that the in-game system seems to have started judging that word much more harshly than it previously did -- helped us to reach our decision. Again, I will not sit here and say it was *everyone*, or even an overwhelming majority. But it was enough that that, combined with the change in the in-game behavioral system, helped to guide our choice here, which I acknowledge undoubtedly frustrates part of the community as much as it pleases another. Making choices like that is never an especially easy thing.
> [{quoted}](name=The Djinn,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=0037000000000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:48:39.244+0000) > > We saw a lot of feedback requesting that, yes. That feedback -- combined with the fact that the in-game system seems to have started judging that word much more harshly than it previously did -- helped us to reach our decision. Did you guys ever really publicly address that you're tightening up on that stuff? Feels like it might be important for the community to know that something like that has changed.
: > [{quoted}](name=iamthegoatofwar,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=0037000000000000000000010000,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:19:59.022+0000)I do think the mods do get quite a bit of say in regards to how flexible the rules are which makes cases like this where wrongful punishment is issued crop up. I'd like to weigh in here a bit. The slightly varying (and, yes, sometimes more than slightly) enforcement is due to a lot of circumstances, and I don't think any of them are due to moderator influence over the rules. * Different people interpret different things differently, and we can't get full team buy-in on every decision. * Nearly every case is slightly different. * People have differing punishment histories and thus may receive differing punishments based on how many previous warnings they have. One of the realities of rule enforcement is that if you have 100% solid, predictable rules you end up with a ton of edge cases and loopholes. If you have slightly more flexible rules you catch more violations, but you invite more room for differing interpretations. We favor the latter here because we have decent ways of discussing things with people and -- frankly -- a lot of people who like to look for loopholes. I readily acknowledge that it's not perfect, and we're always striving to improve clarity and communication. >This is only my own personal opinion though. For example I believe they have only recently (to my knowledge) started removing posts for containing certain terms for disabled people when not used as a direct insult to someone. I believe this not at the request of riot, but a choice made on the moderators end. It is a decision made by the moderation team after seeing this change in the in-game behavioral system and after receiving a lot of feedback on Discord from the community. It's also one that was run by our Riot contacts to ensure that we're not overstepping our authority. In short, it was a change made to keep consistency with in-game enforcement and to meet community demand which -- we're aware -- is not *universal* demand.
"after receiving a lot of feedback on Discord from the community." "to meet community demand" Wait the community wanted these words banned? Am I understanding that correctly or was that a misunderstanding?
: > [{quoted}](name=The Highest Noon,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=00370000000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T15:41:16.196+0000) > > You do not have a say in what THE RULES ARE. Neither do the mods really, they didn't make the rules and can't change them, they are merely the enforcers
> [{quoted}](name=ninjaroxas,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=003700000000000000000001,timestamp=2018-12-03T19:10:48.161+0000) > > Neither do the mods really, they didn't make the rules and can't change them, they are merely the enforcers Half yes, half no. I do think the mods do get quite a bit of say in regards to how flexible the rules are which makes cases like this where wrongful punishment is issued crop up. This is only my own personal opinion though. For example I believe they have only recently (to my knowledge) started removing posts for containing certain terms for disabled people when not used as a direct insult to someone. I believe this not at the request of riot, but a choice made on the moderators end. I DO NOT HAVE ANY EVIDENCE OF THIS being the case however and could be wrong about riot being the ones to request it.
: It's not ever relevant to malign people's mental state. We have somewhat relaxed rules on GD to allow that community to banter a bit, as they are used to doing. When you venture into another person's post on another sub-board and passive-aggressively call out their mental health, you can expect a ban. Like I said, if you want to discuss my lapse in judgement in understanding that situation, I'm open to hearing it. The number of upvotes on your post without context is not the same as discussing the particulars of the situation in a civil manner. If you want to change my mind, you're going to need to help me understand what information I'm missing. I see how many upvotes you have on this post, and I don't find that to be compelling evidence that the ban was wrong. Without context, I wouldn't expect very many people to feel that removal was warranted. I, however, *do* know the context, and it's part of good moderation not to be easily bamboozled out of doing the right thing. If you have a real argument to make, I'm happy to hear it.
> [{quoted}](name=KnightsKemplar,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=00310002000000000000,timestamp=2018-12-03T18:18:47.033+0000) > > It's not ever relevant to malign people's mental state. We have somewhat relaxed rules on GD to allow that community to banter a bit, as they are used to doing. When you venture into another person's post on another sub-board and passive-aggressively call out their mental health, you can expect a ban. > > Like I said, if you want to discuss my lapse in judgement understanding in that situation, I'm open to hearing it. The number of upvotes on your post without context is not the same as discussing the particulars of the situation in a civil manner. If you want to change my mind, you're going to need to help me understand what information I'm missing. I see how many upvotes you have on this post, and I don't find that to be compelling evidence that the ban was wrong. > > Without context, I wouldn't expect very many people to feel that removal was warranted. I, however, *do* know the context, and it's part of good moderation not to be easily bamboozled out of doing the right thing. If you have a real argument to make, I'm happy to hear it. GD is not relevant to this ban at the moment. As for "venturing into another persons post on another sub-board" are you saying I must stay confined to GD with that when I am bring up BOARDS MODERATION ISSUES ON DISCUSS THE BOARDS. You make the claim that it was "passive-aggressive" statement at their mental health. You have absolutely no facts to present that this was the intent behind the message. "I, however, do know the context, and it's part of good moderation not to be easily bamboozled out of doing the right thing". So you're magically able to read my mind and know what I was thinking is how I'm viewing this... "If you have real argument to make, I'm happy to hear it." Given everything that has been posted in this thread this feels very much like a hand wave about all the issues people (at this point as a community it would seem) have stated regarding this case...
: I just like that they cited the Golden Rule about being a jerk. As far as im aware, calling someone power hungry isnt really being a jerk. Even if everyone somehow magically knew who or what the OP was talking about, can you really say they were being a jerk for their post ? I've read it about 10 times by now, and im still failing to see how what the person who was 24 hour banned for , was being a jerk. ???
> [{quoted}](name=NA ignite,realm=NA,application-id=6heBIhQc,discussion-id=5KtMnBEb,comment-id=0039,timestamp=2018-12-03T18:04:41.762+0000) > > I just like that they cited the Golden Rule about being a jerk. > > As far as im aware, calling someone power hungry isnt really being a jerk. > > Even if everyone somehow magically knew who or what the OP was talking about, can you really say they were being a jerk for their post ? > > I've read it about 10 times by now, and im still failing to see how what the person who was 24 hour banned for , was being a jerk. > > ??? Thanks for your thoughts. Shortly I may be moving this gathering to GD to get more awareness to the issue.
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iamthegoatofwar

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