Biazs (NA)
: condemn's cooldown is too long to use it every time
Hurdle is on a a far lower cd than Blitz's W and her condemn is up whenever his hook is. There's not an issue here at all.
Biazs (NA)
: Jumping on carry might work for some adcs like cait or trist but i usually playing with vayne and i cannot do that
If you're vayne you have a knockback and a hurdle for self peel, it shouldn't be a problem.
: It has a bunch of players that battle around online in an arena. What part of Multiplayer Online Battle Arena hasn't League satisfied?
It's entire format was derived from an RTS, the fact that they deviated from that gained them nothing and lost them massive amounts of functionality. They opted out of QoL conveniences deliberately, for no reason.
: Nice edit. Dota 2 is a different game and its developers have different values. If you want to play Dota 2, go ahead. This is the League of Legends forums though, and it's meant for discussion about League of Legends. If "Dota does it" is the only argument you have for a replay system, maybe you should actually reconsider the way you feel about it. The loss for implementing it is other cool features that would better benefit more players. can give me replays, but cannot give me the reworked champion select!
You're basically saying that they should keep their shitty incomplete model of a MOBA because they're in too deep and have other responsibilities now? I think League may run better if ported back to warcraft 3 considering how many functions it doesn't have that it should.
Ionian (EUW)
: With Q's movespeed or ult I can easily dodge his W, and I start {{item:2033}} to null his harass. {{item:3165}} counters his ult heavily and it's what Ahri rushes anyway, no changes in my build. If I just want to completely ignore him, I can also build {{item:3001}} . It's actually an easy lane, but I guess people in silver/gold think what lolcounters says is always undisputable truth. Learn to play vs counters and one day you might climb to a decent elo :^)
So... If he's so easy to deal with what is your issue with him? You screamed like a butthurt child about him being easy to play cancer and then say he's no big deal? Your inconsistency says things about your higher brain function.
: Will it make people toxic if I smurf and go adc/support katarina or akali with a waifu name?
You mean to say you're intimidated by the chance that ambiguous hatred will spring forth from a degenerate bunch of anonymous internet dwellers? Naw you'll be fine, just don't mention ponies, those are internet hatred's lightning rod.
Aazzlano (NA)
: Why does Nasus get nerfed for his sustain yet the new Keystone is allowed to exist?
I'm gunna assume its been said before, but the changes to ADCs are a small part of a larger rework. The game is going to function terribly due to other roles becoming outdated and having their only dynamics brutally eviscerated by newer, stronger, more overloaded champions. Its at the stage where they are going to have to bring everyone up to match the current set of reworks, and as a result, huge masses of champions are going to be utterly useless until their queue time is up. Its basically going to feel like the assassin meta felt to immobile, peel reliant mains; utterly toxic. Give it time, a break from the game is what I'm doing till this shitstorm blows over.
: Poppy Rework - She dont need any RIOT
I might not be catching on to the troll, but her passive needs to be completely reworked and her ultimate should lose duration every time she attacks something other than its target.
: Veigar lost an auto attack worth of damge in nerfs
Yea, makes you wonder how accurately win/play rate statistics correlate to actual champion balance. I'm convinced its akin to the yipps, but with retard's perceptions affecting their play instead of loss of confidence.
Eedat (NA)
: Official petition to restore Thornmail, Randuin's, and Frozen Heart
I want to see a Red post on this, but chances are the person who mans up won't be able to do anything about it. The changes were stupid and ill conceived when they were made in the first place. Now that armor items are the equivalent of holding a paper shield up against a flame thrower, Riot will give it the "wait and see" treatment even though anyone with neurons firing in their dome knows that's completely unnecessary.
: Rest in Peace Tanks
They need to restore cinderhulk to its prime to counterbalance the change, as the tank meta was also the only thing that facilitated against the assassin meta of old and allowed champions who weren't given 3 free passives and spammable mobility to survive.
: Look here buddy I don't have anything to say because all you guys will ever do is defend your freelo and bombard anyone who says he is broken with downvotes. This board is the definition of hypocrisy. They will swear Zed is 0 counter play bullshit, but when Veigar is broken they will say just build a zhonyas. They will swear Yasuo is super unfun to play against, but his 14% ban rate compared to veigars 48% ban rate in plat+ really shows who people prefer to play against. They swear its unfair Yasuos windwall is an ultimate level ability meanwhile Veigar had an improved Jarvan and Thresh ult. They will sit there and swear all their mages are really balanced and continue to complain about champs that don't even have 50% win rates in higher elos, while lux ahri and veigar all have huge win rates and huge play rates. Face it Veigar is over buffed, and needs nerfs this entire boards is just hypocritical. Please tell me Veigar doesn't need nerfs while he sits there with his 14% pick rate 48% ban rate and 52% win rate all in plat+. Stop dodging the obvious with all your excuses. There is simply no point arguing a mage is broken here because this entire boards is a low elo mage main circle jerk.
Veigar's ban and pick rate are a response to noobs seeing him played in LCS and everyone shitting themselves over what he does. They have the retarded notion that all-inning him is impossible allowing him to get past his early game worthlessness. They refuse to itemize properly and assume since they got encircled by his E that they can no longer dodge the ability that can only consume 30% of the total area inside the E. Assassins have oddly fell out of popularity, and they were his main counter, just like how tanks shat on the assassins of the previous meta. You spewing out statistics makes your argument weaker as well, because statistically, Veigar never needed to be reworked in 5.4. Maybe somebody would value your opinion just a little if you had legitimate gripes and comparisons, but all you have is statistics from low ass elos giving you an incomplete profile of his actual strength.
: Don't bother complaining about mages on the boards. This place is a low elo mage main fuck fest lol. Dw Veigar's ridiculously high ban rate+high winrate will definitely net some nerfs from riot :^).
So you don't have anything relevant to say? You on the Veigar hate bandwagon because dodging his highly telegraphed attacks and building slightly different items is beneath you?
Modwalla (NA)
: whats so wrong about it? as long as u don't get stunned she cant kill you u get banshee and she can q u for the spell shield and then ult
: > [{quoted}](name=CrestKnight,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=c12k9cQx,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2015-10-27T11:42:57.466+0000) > > oh im sorry we were in a 50++ minutes game, he was allowed to snowball and or reach +500 ++++ bonus AP + full AP build, necessary to 1hko you with R alone. (calculated hp + spirit visiage MR) > > isn't it surprising that a champion with infinite scaling does tons of damages in the late game? > > the only 2 differences between him and nasus is instead of killing champions, he takes turrets, and instead of being squishy ranged, hes tanky melee, why aren't we complaining about those 2000 damage nasus 2second Q's? isnt surprising a champion with infinite ap scaling and retarded ratios is broken? isnt it surprising nasus has no range whatsoever and is insanely easy to kite? downvote me plebs, veigar is broken
Get 1 decent assassin to take Veigar out of the equation before the fight and problem solved. He was absolute garbage back in the assassin meta even though every noob is spouting that he was op in hindsight. Aside from 1 skill in his kit, everything can be dodged and/or countered by some item. The only true thing you've spouted was that Nasus is balanced via kitability, whereas Veigar is immobile and squishy as fuck.
: Another mystery to me,Since blitz is designed to be a top lane fighter,why do people play him only support when he does nothing but grab and damage?
Even before his W was shitcanned he wasn't amazing top lane. He has a lot of lockdown and good mana synergy but until level 6 his dueling power is really bad. I play him offensively in Dominion with a manamune build and he absolutely crushes, but people prefer to use him as an engage bot disregarding all the strengths his kit offers.
: Blitz
He only seems godlike because its the noob mentality enforced meta to pick a squishy adc into him. If the lane composition ever changed like when they made Morde a bot lane carry, Blitz would be garbage.
Archon X (NA)
: aight go find a support and get me an adc and we'll do a 2v2 bot lane and see what happens
Yea, i want to see the blitz darius lane against whatever the fuck you have to offer.
: Because most of the community is ignorant sheep who avoid everything that's not 'pro' build like the plague :/
Same noobs who think Blitz is overpowered just because he shits on that terrible composition by design.
: bruisers have their main powerspike midgame and are xp/level dependent and a bit less item dependent than adc. sharing a duo lane sets them back. same reason why you dont play mages with a support on bot lane. also, if you dont have an adc somewhere else, like quinn on top or kindred, youre gonna have a hell of a time pushing turrets by midgame or taking objectives like baron or drake. meaning the game drags out until lategame, where fighters fall off and adc get dominate. > [{quoted}](name=Archon X,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=VKr0f2KA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2015-10-28T07:44:23.820+0000) > > lol what > > the enemy adc will have range, and a support to prevent you from face-tanking this is also true. a double bruiser bot lane is hit or miss. either youre completely snowballing and stomping the lane, or you get poked and kited the shit out of you and lose hard. melees cant even cs under their turret against an adc. another adc can due to the extra distance they have from their opponent.
Annie Veigar Velkoz Zyra... These are all mages.
: Give me one good reason
It's something I've been saying for a while, the kind of comp that counters the currently enforced picks. The need for a squishy adc and support in botlane is what makes blitz seem op, even though hooking a darius or jax is suicide. It's the reason Veigar was taken bot and saw any success at all, and was subsequently nerfed.
: so. why did you make this thread? i don't think theirs any body really complaining about hermdinger atm
They crawl out of the woodwork once a nerf decimates the champion of interest to provide testimony to how busted they supposedly were.
Enosetc (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sh4de,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=uAFjEGNY,comment-id=000100020000,timestamp=2015-10-26T13:58:20.410+0000) > > Biggest thing not mentioned is how castrated Veigar is in a bad lane match up. He recovers from his shit early game much better than he did, before it could remove him from the game completely, so the fact that he was 3 levels up and was able to waltz right up to an adc without her support being there means that there were serious misplays in the Veigar's favor, discrediting this entire post. misplays such as: being targetable being in range of veigar's abilities while the argument that cait was overextended holds merit, veigar was able to make serious misplays (such as whiffing half his kit) and still kill cait with two point and click abilities the rework was needed and deserved.
Letting a immobile glass cannon mage with short range close in on you as a caitlyn who can take out 50% of his health with a single Q from a longer range than he can engage with is a complete misplay, caitlyn is given disengage and high ranged poke to nullify such situations in exchange for her squishiness. Using her as an example to balance a burst mage that's ahead of her in level is on a different level of stupidity than I can deal with. Any champion designed to trade blows in the game would have survived that exchange, caitlyn is not meant to trade, she's meant to be peeled for so she can tunnel autoattacks at a safe range.
: I'm sorry but the no banshee's or GA comment is ridiculous with no context. This could easily be at 20 mins when she only has enough gold for Infinity edge and a zeal. Saying you can counterbuild is great, but not all games last to 6 items and her support would probably have afked if she built banhees first item because there was a veigar on the enemy team. Caitlin was lvl 12 in the clip, how many times have you got a banshees or GA at lvl 12 when you play adc?
Biggest thing not mentioned is how castrated Veigar is in a bad lane match up. He recovers from his shit early game much better than he did, before it could remove him from the game completely, so the fact that he was 3 levels up and was able to waltz right up to an adc without her support being there means that there were serious misplays in the Veigar's favor, discrediting this entire post.
qeenbo (NA)
: veigar needs to be debuffed right away.
I know she's not imba at this very moment, but the fact that you're trying to argue against Veigar as one of the most cancerous mage assassins in the game really devalues your point. Plenty of people can zhonyas the veigar ult, so there's no reason you shouldn't be able to.
Alox (NA)
: And if you get trapped inside (not stunned) you're kinda dead anyway because he can W that covers a lot of the area, and R is instant cast on you..
Yea, roughly 30% of it, leaving a full 70% of the cage to use as dodging space.
: Mocking shout should be a long range expanding cone instead of a moderate range instantaneous circle
First person I've seen start a trynd topic that didn't spew OP and ask for obliteration via overnerfing. Props to you good sir.
: That word is "Voila!" which I know is kind of counterintuitive. (other languages man) Honestly the W nerf is better than an R nerf, though. his W at rank 5 is basically another rank 2 ultimate, so tuning the damage a bit is really not the end of the world - it's still gonna chunk, just not as hard as early, which is fine. This nerf is better than removing stuff on his ult, because I think his ultimate is fine where it is (though people wanna complain) - this is something that doesn't REALLY hurt Veigar's seige/push/waveclear/etc but does reduce his ability to burst tanky targets as easily (since a squishy target is still gonna die to Q>R or Q>W>R, even with the damage changes).
No veigar main is worried that the W nerf will break him, they're worried that Riot will take the shit too far like they did in 5.4 and completely ruin him again. Since he's designed to stomp noobs, noobs will always have a problem with him.
Bronzoid (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Inept Maverick,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=dEGpq9B0,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2015-09-25T16:11:21.839+0000) > > (walks into range of burst champion, easily sets up their combo) > > WHY SO MUCHD AMAGE NERRRFF! > > Guys, calm down and learn to play against him. Yea so I should stay in the backline as a tank/bruiser?
No, you should definitely eat his Q and R, because the second you have, your team has won. His W and E are basically impossible to land unless the enemy is a moron and gets caught out and then proceeds to stand still in a 10 unit width sliver for half a second so his fence can hit.
Penns (EUW)
: You can deal with, lets say Annies burst, but Veigars burst is hard. Like, he has 200 more base dmg, scales better and has 80% enemy AP scaling too + his E is way better than Annies E. He has skillshots but Ill take that.
Ah, because you're so bad at the game that he always lands his E and W on you regardless of circumstance. Your comparison fails because Veigar pays for his damage with massive delays and unreliability, Annie's simply relies on her Flash CD.
Lafouboy (NA)
: Face it, they're gonna nerf him into the ground. They're going to Akali/Kha'Zix/Cassiopeia/Kassadin (with his Riftlimp) him. History has shown that if a champion is strong and the community complains about it then Riot overnerfs them to compensate. The problem is that Veigar is not overpowered; there are many ways to counter him. He is flavor of the month. There's no arguing that he is powerful at the moment, but not so powerful that he needs lots of nerfs. They are going to overnerf him, which will send him back to a state of utter mediocrity. They will either do it at a medium pace or they will do it very slowly. Either way, history has shown that the most likely course of "balance" Riot will take is over nerfing Veigar, sending him back into the "never picked for a good reason" zone. This may seem like a little nerf, but it really isn't. It's about a 220 dmg nerf for Veigar's late game considering he will likely have around 1k AP; which is an AOE nerf, meaning it can potentially be a bigger damage nerf if his W would hit more than 1 person. The worst part is, this is not even going to stop him from being a popular pick, meaning that people will keep complaining about him until he is completely killed (or another "OMG SO OP" pick takes his place on the "RIOT NERF OMG SO STUPID! THIS CHAMP IS THE REASON I AM STUCK IN MY DIVISION!!!!!"), meaning that Riot will keep nerfing him until that happens. He's gonna go through some tough times, eventually becoming around the low 40's winrate again (if not worse than that). Yet again, history has shown this to be true and this will not change for Veigar. In essence, Veigar is gonna get killed by Riot and the bitchy community. When it happens, I am going to start another thread and quote this exact post of mine to tell you all that I was correct.. that I am ALWAYS CORRECT (seriously, look at my posts. I have predicted throughout the seasons so many things, such as Support Fiddle being OP, Tanky jungle Yi with Titanic Hydra becoming a thing, I predicted Veigar's E would be able to stop dashes the day before it was announced, that Teemo would be able to throw his shrooms in a future update, and so many more things; I EVEN PREDICTED THAT A BUFF TO VEIGAR WOULD MAKE HIM PICK/BAN JUST A FEW MONTHS BACK). This is happening. Veigar's time to die is upon us soon enough.
Veigar was NEVER overpowered. He has always thrived on noobish mistakes and always maintained a balanced play and win rate, but every goddamn time he got featured in LCS, a giant bronze monolith amasses to feed tears into riot's ears in appeal of him being dumpstered.
Lafouboy (NA)
: A suggested nerf for Veigar, because obviously Riot and the community want it
Yes, wood division's most perceptive minds saw that the Veigar that had been forsaken by the LCS gods after his fall from grace had suddenly clawed his way out of the hell that their incredible ineptitude put him in and thought they'd lose the ability to stargaze mid match without punishment. His numbers were increased and a bit of reliability was added but that's not what they bitch about, its his "god mode" E that takes a half second to form and a hundredth of that time to sidestep which wasn't even touched. You know how before he was gutted in 5.4 his E was lackluster in terms of zone control since every one and their crippled grandmother could dash through it? They called for the utility shift and now they're bitching about it once again.
: > [{quoted}](name=Ackelope,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gFBTVlOt,comment-id=0005000000000000,timestamp=2015-10-16T19:04:59.297+0000) > > Nasus doesn't fall off really, he's easily kited in late game I guess, but that's true for all parts of the game. Nasus just keeps on scaling, same goes for Veigar, Bard, Thresh, and Kindred. Veigar's scaling is the most annoying because it gives him AP, which all of his abilities scale quite well with, rather than increasing the dmg of one ability. He *does* fall off though. His midgame is great but once full teamfights start to happen he's less useful than a huge number of other champions even though they *don't* have infinte scaling, because he will never actually get to do his damage to anyone who matters. And again, Nasus is actually weak in lane. Veigar is not.
Veigar is not good in lane, wtf are you on? He plays like a scared sheep since half of his kit will never hit a target in a 1v1 situation, so he can be bullied easily. Since he literally has 1 ability to trade with in lane and its his all important ap farming ability he either commits to trying to defend himself with it or passively farm ap under enemy fire. Unlike Veigar who has no defensive synergies to help him deliver his payload, nasus has passive lifesteal, good health per level, an ult that increases tankiness and a reliable disable. Your argument ignores the very high chances of Veigar's abilities not landing because the person they were thrown onto wasn't choking on appleasauce, reliability is a huge crutch, and that lack of makes his dueling potential the worst in the game.
: Wrong thing to nerf, they should've reworked his ultimate. At least they recognize that he's stupid right now, though.
Stupid how? He was played by pros? People are just now realizing he's a slave to team fights and is useless alone. Veigar's the type of champ that needs his entire team to build around his existence, because without absurd amounts of peel from allies, any assassin with firing neurons can take him out with little possible repercussions. If being good when every possible condition for success is met is overpowered, then does that make any champion who can build into other comps and be useful stupid as well?
: > [{quoted}](name=Sh4de,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=gFBTVlOt,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2015-10-16T06:13:34.451+0000) > > Now its legitimately worse than Brand's pillar, and still twice the delay! Except that it does more damage than Brand's pillar at all ranks, and Veigar will still have at least 1.5 times the AP brand has.
If we're quoting stats, a brand pillar will have 5% less ratio but higher base damages when hitting a burning target, not to mention dealing % max health damage by applying his passive. Lets also remember the fact that Veigar needs to soak 2 abilities to land his W, whereas brand doesn't.
Dregn hun (EUNE)
: Vayne stomps soloQ and peaple complain about her contantly -> after like 3 months they remove 3 ad. Veigar is picked like 2 or 3 times in worlds->-20% ap on w and -20 dmg on a skillshot, that is impossible to land without the crippled e. (veigar was considered weak before worlds). Is this a joke @RIOT ?!?
The boards are filled with retards, anyone saying he's op since he was actually played in competitive are just brain dead sheep ignorant to the massive amount of built in counterplay he's had since his botched rework.
Trídent (NA)
: O.O y rito
Now its legitimately worse than Brand's pillar, and still twice the delay!
: Rushing Zhonyas against Veigar has got to be the WORST argument I've seen in a long time. Not does Seeker give you more AP (hurr durr Primordial burst) as you farm, but it grants armor and you net less AP when you upgrade into Zhonyas (120 for NLR + Seekers, 100 AP for Zhonyas) Now you've gimped your mana regen, still have no MR, still susceptible to being stunned and bursted before you can Zhonyas and let's not forget that even if you DID Zhonya's his ult, you're probably in an infavorable position and will get rekt by his teammates or locked into his cage.
The cage still requires you as the opponent to misplay in order to get stunned by it, so that's on you. Being zoned doesn't help him land shit so you should be able to zhonya's if you're not being double teamed.
: ***
Last rework of him failed miserably since it wasn't even a complete rework. If they do something, I'd like them to invest more than just a single intern's time into it and keep CT the fuck away from it.
: Honestly, Veigar shouldn't even have that 80% enemy AP ratio on his ult
He's not an anti mage, he punishes bad builds and bad plays. If no mistakes are made, he's incredibly weak, as 1/3 of his damage is reliant on you standing still for a full second. This is the primary reason he excels in team fights, because his allies can force people to eat his highly telegraphed easily dodged ablities.
Cibreca (NA)
: That's a good point, but that doesn't mean that a 887.5 range 2.5 second stun with an 1178 circumference isn't a bit OP. Sure, he can be counter played--but the numbers don't lie. 2.5 second stun--and 3 second corralling, is OP. Nevermind his AP growth and mana regen. Sure it can be countered--but that's presuming a 1v1. In a team fight, Veigar is no joke.
Veigar's team fight is just as counterable as his 1v1, people just panic stupidly when they're caught out, which is their fault in the first place. Veigar's number are incredible but every ability is reliant on an opponent fucking up with their build or their play, so if neither fuck ups occur, then he's spectacularly useless.
: I believe "get rid of his stun" was his solution.
and what a bad solution it was.
: What caused Veigar to become OP?
Seen in competitive play for the first time after the void that was 5.4 and he's suddenly OP, god people are stupid.
Enosetc (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sh4de,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jHXAPuc0,comment-id=00050000000000000000000000010000000000000000,timestamp=2015-10-12T02:37:09.260+0000) > > I was pointing out why people are dismissing the OP, because you made a god awful choice for a comparison. yeah, the consensus is that vayne is overpowered right now. i get that and i agree with it i'm saying that the reason it feels like riot ignores this board sometimes is because it circlejerks bad logic and fallacious arguments (aka the +10 comment in this thread that says "here are vayne's strengths. here are veigar's weaknesses. this is why i believe x is balanced) i don't really mind if people dismiss my op because it's funny watching threads with 100+ upvotes get necro'd when this board was **completely wrong** about something they said months ago and have to deal with it now
So you intentionally made a bad comparison to bring people's hypocrisy to the surface? I don't see that as a constructive way to use the boards. If you were trying to say Vayne is OP but other champs have the same busted ass counterless playstyles then you had a wellspring of champions to pick from.
Enosetc (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sh4de,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jHXAPuc0,comment-id=000500000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2015-10-11T10:33:15.260+0000) > > The choice was hilariously bad, sorry if my phrasing didn't make that clear. the original poster of the comment thread listed a bunch of vayne's strengths and compared them to veigar's weaknesses i said "hey, i can do the same thing" and did the inverse of course it was a hilariously bad choice -- listing a bunch of strengths vs. a bunch of weaknesses is a shitty argument to begin with
I was pointing out why people are dismissing the OP, because you made a god awful choice for a comparison.
Enosetc (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=Sh4de,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jHXAPuc0,comment-id=0005000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2015-10-11T08:07:43.507+0000) > > The issue is you pulling out Veigar as a contrast, when he's been shit since 5.4 and has only recently started seeing any hint at viability. Consider the difficulty of accomplishing a full Veigar combo on a competent player versus closing in on a person with Vayne's retarded chase passive and 2 second cd dash and auto attacking them till they die. Veigar lets a person close in on him and he dies, Vayne does the same and has that abundance of mobility plus the ability to lob a poppy at them to cancel any gap closer used against her (for most champions, they only have 1). I don't think anyone would have an issue with your post of not for the hilariously bad champion you picked to do your comparison of. Call me sheepish, but I have a terribly hard time believing that a champion that's picked/banned on the stage of the biggest LoL tournament is "hilariously bad"
The choice was hilariously bad, sorry if my phrasing didn't make that clear.
Enosetc (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=ZeusHasRefresher,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=jHXAPuc0,comment-id=00050000000000000000,timestamp=2015-10-11T07:32:42.713+0000) > > veigar, zone has 0.75 sec delay, in this time most people can travel at least 300 unit which will give them the time to go out. i'm not even counting the freaking mobility creep. it also doesn't stun for 3 seconds but for 2.5 seconds. > his ulti is magic damage which can be countered by mr or health or hexdrinker > > vayne has no skill to damage beyond 550, but she has 480 ms with her ulti berseker and PD, she doesn't need this range she can just engage a fight while running towards every 380 ms adc. "needs to autoattack the same target to keep her damage high" yea like everyone. > > what are those arguments you have? " she has no passive if she is not chasing an enemy". Welp darius has no passive if he isn't fighting, yorick has no passive if he doesn't have gools. skarner has no passive if he isn't in his zone. swain has no passive if he isn't farming, sivir has no passive if she isn't hitting her enemies I said zone, not stun. The cage stays on the field for 3 seconds. Additionally, I made my hypothetical argument for Vayne not being too strong as shitty as possible by pulling random weaknesses in her kit. Why are you arguing with an argument that I'm not actually backing? I literally said Vayne is too strong in the last post.
The issue is you pulling out Veigar as a contrast, when he's been shit since 5.4 and has only recently started seeing any hint at viability. Consider the difficulty of accomplishing a full Veigar combo on a competent player versus closing in on a person with Vayne's retarded chase passive and 2 second cd dash and auto attacking them till they die. Veigar lets a person close in on him and he dies, Vayne does the same and has that abundance of mobility plus the ability to lob a poppy at them to cancel any gap closer used against her (for most champions, they only have 1). I don't think anyone would have an issue with your post of not for the hilariously bad champion you picked to do your comparison of.
: Lol I hate when I see people say that, it's so presumptuous of the Blitz player's skill.
It says more about the plaintiff's skill than the blitz. Being caught out of position will get anyone killed by any champion in the game, people cry about blitzcrank because their fuckups are the sole source of blitz's success.
: Blitz can miss all hooks whole game or just chill in general. But one hook under baron/dragon and he won you a game.
Or lose a game, just have a tank eat it, or are people afraid to play tanks since Vayne exists? As difficult as it may seem to dodge his hooks, having a tank purposefully eat them is unbelievably easy. Blitz hooks a tank and he's initiated for them, now his team is forced to blow everything on the tank to kill him, or ignore it whist it goes to town on their squishies. If your team is comprised on eggplants who can't follow up then thats their fault, not blitz's.
: Pretty much. I recently won a 4v5 by baiting him into doing exactly that when i was full build naut. Although if you're too deep into elo hell your team will just stand around confused as you die... and then engage 20 seconds later 4v5.
That's exactly the demographic bitching about blitz though, the ones stuck in elo hell. Anybody decent at the game who doesn't get overwhelmed by having to perform their champion's base functions AND play differently against their lane opponents have no problems with him. They can't come to terms with the fact that his counterplay is clear as day and they can't manage to impliment it, so they cry for nerfs and deletion.
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