: Legends of Runeterra - Fiora Needs Nerfed
Except that shes really easy to kill, especially considering everyone including me is running SI decks rn which has alot of removal. Alot of SI decks also utilize demacia so detain is a thing
LostCub (NA)
: Akali nerf 10.3
Fucking thank the lord jesus.
PiVoRx (EUNE)
: How scaling champions are supposted to scale if almost every game ends in 20min?
> [{quoted}](name=PiVoRx,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=vY825EVc,comment-id=,timestamp=2020-01-16T19:10:02.501+0000) > > First tower falls in 10min, every other in 20, after that its just survival game in your own base. Are you stuck in some tine loop that sends you back to season 2? Back then scaling champs actually had to farm for 20-25+ minutes to utilize their scaling potential, now champs like ryze, kass and the gamut of adc’s are shitstomping everything by level 10-11 like ten seconds after the first tower has fallen.
: s10 jungle encapsulated.
> [{quoted}](name=Crescent Dusk,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9KVo1YZ5,comment-id=,timestamp=2020-01-14T03:20:04.560+0000) > > Enemy jg trolls with Tryndamere pick. Go 7/1 eve by minute 10 while he's 4/2. Bot lane decides it's a good idea to facetank a tryndamere with ult, he starts racking up kills. > > My team's 6/6/5 TF: "Eve, you're literally dogshit" > > My KDA's on par with their winning bot lane with 1 kill up. I have 8 deaths less than my combined bot lane and 5 less than my midlane. > > Tryndamere jg proceeds with "lol jg diff, and you thought picking teemo top was going to work". > > {{sticker:sg-lux-2}} > > I wonder why jungle is autofilled so much now. So fr the past month now ive been getting autofilled jg quite frequently(cus jgmains acting like the sky is falling) and even in instances where my kda was very poor, including a game where i went like 3/11 i have literally faced no criticism when playing as jg, not a peep. Not a single “you’re trash” or “why werent you X?” Or “jg diff” or “we dont have a jungle” So i dunno, seems like jg doesnt get as much criticism as people let on.
: Elder should only execute on next attack or damaging ability, not from dots/spell effects, or be 15%
To be honest, while i feel its strong, it wouldnt be so bad if we weren't playing league of burst damage. Its not that it does too much, its scaling makes sense considering its a 30+ minute game closing objective, the problem is that its way too easy to proc. Damage in this game needs to be hard nerfed across the board
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=R3cp3cUs,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2020-01-11T13:42:28.005+0000) > > For sure all these jungle mains need to quit crying. For the past few weeks ive been getting autofilled jungle, i dont mind at all. The only reason i dont qeue jg secondary is because it would mean i never get mid. So i qeue mid/top and rolll with it if i get fill. > > Jg is a fucking vacation compared to top, its so easy to impact your gamee as jg right now and the exp claims are way overblown. The EXP changes are not overblown entirely, the issue i find is that the people crying act like they are permanently down on levels even when it´s not true and it´s even easy to prove that. As for after that? Well they are junglers! If they fail to gank before then and even then to put enemy laners down then they have failed or that laner has succeeded magnificently somehow. Why should they have the privilege to easily to screw a laner who has done their best to win and secure a large lead early? What is actually the point of playing a laner if it is so simple for the junglers to stop them? Might as well just go main jungle then. > Im not even a jungle main and i have zero issues staying within 2 levels of solo laners, halfvthe time i match them in levels. Right same deal here really, for the first 5 levels you are basically guaranteed to be even in levels, it´s only after that point that you need to gank to ensure you stay even. And i mean how hard is that actually when playing any of the meta junglers? Not at all......most of them can even go in from an earlier point and even they can create a situation where they are always even in EXP.
> [{quoted}](name=Thefrostyviking,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=R3cp3cUs,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2020-01-11T14:18:05.769+0000) > > The EXP changes are not overblown entirely, the issue i find is that the people crying act like they are permanently down on levels even when it´s not true and it´s even easy to prove that. > > As for after that? Well they are junglers! If they fail to gank before then and even then to put enemy laners down then they have failed or that laner has succeeded magnificently somehow. > > Why should they have the privilege to easily to screw a laner who has done their best to win and secure a large lead early? What is actually the point of playing a laner if it is so simple for the junglers to stop them? Might as well just go main jungle then. > > Right same deal here really, for the first 5 levels you are basically guaranteed to be even in levels, it´s only after that point that you need to gank to ensure you stay even. > > And i mean how hard is that actually when playing any of the meta junglers? Not at all......most of them can even go in from an earlier point and even they can create a situation where they are always even in EXP. When im saying the exp changes are overblown, im talking bout the jungle mains sitting on boards who make the claim that it is now the norm for junglers to be 3-4 lvls below the solos and below the duo lane half the games they are in. I agree that xp was nerfed, though only slightly, which makes sense, functionally speaking its not really balanced for a jg to match solos in levels. It still doesnt make sense that many junglers can level 2 gank lvl 1 solos or lvl 3 gank lvl 2 solos, but i feel that the exp nerfs finally brought the jg to where it needs to be, and thats notveven considering the fact that the added impact of s10 dragons and herald made it more of a sidegrade than a nerf for the role overall. I think the biggest reason junglers are pissed is that they used to be able to gank lanes with absolutely horrid technique, but they could just gank the same lane 3-4 times in a row and then waltz back into the jungle and abuse catchup XP. Now that they cant do that, alot of subpar junglers are seeing the flaws in their gameplay for the first time, and they want something to blame.
: Debunking bullshit about jungle EXP&gold income.
For sure all these jungle mains need to quit crying. For the past few weeks ive been getting autofilled jungle, i dont mind at all. The only reason i dont qeue jg secondary is because it would mean i never get mid. So i qeue mid/top and rolll with it if i get fill. Jg is a fucking vacation compared to top, its so easy to impact your gamee as jg right now and the exp claims are way overblown. Im not even a jungle main and i have zero issues staying within 2 levels of solo laners, halfvthe time i match them in levels.
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xOFYxVmA,comment-id=00000004,timestamp=2020-01-04T02:11:12.134+0000) > > Im not necessarily taking a side here, but based on some basic math, all other things being equal 10/146= just under a 7% chance of any champion being in a single game excluding bans. With that being said, From what i understand ekko has a relatively high banrate, so having nearly double the baseline pickrate despite it might be considered a red flag. Isnt caits 27% pick rate a bigger red flag?
> [{quoted}](name=Dreamspitter,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xOFYxVmA,comment-id=000000040000,timestamp=2020-01-04T02:32:18.702+0000) > > Isnt caits 27% pick rate a bigger red flag? i suppose it could be, though her ban rate is half of ekko's and her win rate is smaller.
: > [{quoted}](name=metroman450,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xOFYxVmA,comment-id=,timestamp=2020-01-03T09:44:03.141+0000) > > This champ is actually a bs design. He has a fcking shield which scales with ap. His Q and E takes more than half your health in the early game. His ult is literally a "oh I messed up riot save me". So are we gonna ignore the fact that he has a 13% pickrate which is actually huge and a 53% win rate which clearly indicates he's broken. So is riot gonna be nerfing him any time soon? I'm actually tired of him dominating every game tbh. He's too strong and needs tuning down. I really hate Ekko. 13% is huge?
> [{quoted}](name=Dreamspitter,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=xOFYxVmA,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2020-01-03T10:18:12.193+0000) > > 13% is huge? Im not necessarily taking a side here, but based on some basic math, all other things being equal 10/146= just under a 7% chance of any champion being in a single game excluding bans. With that being said, From what i understand ekko has a relatively high banrate, so having nearly double the baseline pickrate despite it might be considered a red flag.
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Q0OYFX3j,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-12-31T02:36:06.062+0000) > > the thing is that none of those other wall like abilities have a power that matches that of an ultimate. in certain cases a well placed windwall can deflect upwards of thousands of points worth of damage. Even the ability to deter people from shooting projectiles for almost four seconds is in itself very powerful. Hang on, I thought your one problem with Yasuo W was that he can use it on projectiles that are near him, not all this other stuff. Hmmmmmm. And if the problem is that it can deflect or deter damage, why not make this complaint about Tryn, Kayle, Fiora, Fizz, Bard, etc.? How very puzzling! > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Q0OYFX3j,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-12-31T02:36:06.062+0000) > > another thing is that using an ability like windwall, and being able to basically use it reactively, as opposed to proactively, based on the way it functions is like the exact opposite of skill expressive. You think building a wall and setting up camp rather than quickly reacting to stimuli is a better expression of skill? What skill would that be, exactly? The skill of not being an interactive gameplay element? Honestly, you had a (very small) chance of passing this off as a legit thread rather than a common anti-Yasuo rant, but you irreversibly ruined that when you used it as a springboard to launch into a bunch of other complaints after you specifically said you only had one. =\
> [{quoted}](name=KFCeytron,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Q0OYFX3j,comment-id=000500000000,timestamp=2019-12-31T03:24:20.936+0000) > > Hang on, I thought your one problem with Yasuo W was that he can use it on projectiles that are near him, not all this other stuff. Hmmmmmm. And if the problem is that it can deflect or deter damage, why not make this complaint about Tryn, Kayle, Fiora, Fizz, Bard, etc.? How very puzzling! > > You think building a wall and setting up camp rather than quickly reacting to stimuli is a better expression of skill? What skill would that be, exactly? The skill of not being an interactive gameplay element? > > Honestly, you had a (very small) chance of passing this off as a legit thread rather than a common anti-Yasuo rant, but you irreversibly ruined that when you used it as a springboard to launch into a bunch of other complaints after you specifically said you only had one. =\ See this is you missing the point entirely, my point is that with it being such a strong ability, it doesn’t really make sense that yasuo is allowed to literally throw that shit sideways or backwards when a projectile is literally on top of him and fizz it out. Im saying thats its not something you can put in the same vein as an anivia wall when were talking about reactive use. Im not saying you should have to necessarily throw out windwall literally seconds before hand, especially considering its 4 second duration, but it should at least require a tiny tiny bit of forethought to use properly, most yasuos just use it as a vastly superior version of the barrier spell on a 20 second cooldown. Im also definitely not saying we should nerf windwall itself by the numbers or that other parts of his kit should be changed. Im merely saying that yasuo players should not be able to benefit from using a skillshot 180 degrees in the wrong direction after pooping their pants and fizz projectiles that are literally on top of them. Windwall also should not fizz projectiles when its placed the correct direction if the projectile in question has already passed where the wall visually generates when its cast.
: His W casts 400 units away from him and then drifts another 50 for a total of 450 units. Having his W originate from him doesn't just give him those extra few milliseconds to react; it allows him to use it against projectiles that _originate_ from closer than 450 units away. Changing this would not only be a weird disincentive for a melee champion to be in melee, but also remove the skill expression of using that fraction of a second of wall movement. Karthus and Anivia can cast their walls anywhere within range, and no one says "Anivia shouldn't be able to block champs who are already on top of her. If you get close enough to her without her reacting, she shouldn't be able to block you at the last possible pixel." Even Cass, a ranged mage, got her W changed to remove the minimum cast distance restriction. But then, none of those champs are hated as much as Yasuo, are they... ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯
> [{quoted}](name=KFCeytron,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Q0OYFX3j,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2019-12-31T02:25:14.236+0000) > > His W casts 400 units away from him and then drifts another 50 for a total of 450 units. Having his W originate from him doesn't just give him those extra few milliseconds to react; it allows him to use it against projectiles that _originate_ from closer than 450 units away. Changing this would not only be a weird disincentive for a melee champion to be in melee, but also remove the skill expression of using that fraction of a second of wall movement. Karthus and Anivia can cast their walls anywhere within range, and no one says "Anivia shouldn't be able to block champs who are already on top of her. If you get close enough to her without her reacting, she shouldn't be able to block you at the last possible pixel." Even Cass, a ranged mage, got her W changed to remove the minimum cast distance restriction. But then, none of those champs are hated as much as Yasuo, are they... ¯\\\_(ツ)\_/¯ the thing is that none of those other wall like abilities have a power that matches that of an ultimate. in certain cases a well placed windwall can deflect upwards of thousands of points worth of damage. Even the ability to deter people from shooting projectiles for almost four seconds is in itself very powerful. another thing is that using an ability like windwall, and being able to basically use it reactively, as opposed to proactively, based on the way it functions is like the exact opposite of skill expressive.
Rewt (NA)
: My 1 problem with Yasuo Wind Wall
its even worse for gragas mains, if u throw a barrel and its reached the end spot but is still spinning it gets fizzed out by windwall.
: > [{quoted}](name=HideSide,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7EXFxLQj,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-12-09T19:51:59.309+0000) > > Better would be to nerf her early range and then dmg. She should have it like trist just more noticeable, even on spells... Range nerfs flat out gut champions. Remember Annie used to be pick/ban as a support. Then they nerfed just her auto range by 50 and she became trash tier.
> [{quoted}](name=The thigh guy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7EXFxLQj,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-12-09T19:56:53.666+0000) > > Range nerfs flat out gut champions. > > Remember Annie used to be pick/ban as a support. Then they nerfed just her auto range by 50 and she became trash tier. The problem is just how much her range has to do with her inherent power/opness Numbers wise when im facing off against her, i don’t really feel like shes even that strong, with that being said her root’s range basically allows her to make game changing picks almost identical in impact to hook supports, except shes mot melee/short range like they are. Her ult already has strong impact, i think maybe her scaling range should be nerfed a tad, but the main thing that needs to be nerfed Is her root range. shes just way too safe as a backline for her to be making the impact shes making
: Leads need to be scaled back
If anything the multitudes of catchup mechanics added to the game over the years has made the game worse. It basically makes it so that you’re only as strong as the less skilled half of your team and makes it so very difficult to carry yourself out of bad situations. For that reason alone id prefer the game get a little more snowbally.
Kaje (NA)
: {{item:3085}} is more effective. On hit effects are applied to the additional "bolts" every single attack. {{item:3285}} requires using an ability after charging the Luden's, and I'm almost 100% positive Luden's doesn't work the way you say it does. I'll use {{champion:17}} as an example because I think it's immediately obvious how Luden's would work. You seem to be suggesting that- if an Ally of mine walks into a Teemo shroom, I will get poisoned if only the Luden's splash hits me. But again, almost 100% positive that this isn't the case. Runes like Ravenous Hunter obviously apply because the bonus damage from Luden's is still "damage dealt". So after ALL damage is applied, then the % Healing is considered. Another equally silly argument would be "The extra shots from {{item:3085}} shouldn't apply Lifesteal."
> [{quoted}](name=Kaje,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=4kuEugBY,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-12-07T01:33:10.028+0000) > > {{item:3085}} is more effective. On hit effects are applied to the additional "bolts" every single attack. {{item:3285}} requires using an ability after charging the Luden's, and I'm almost 100% positive Luden's doesn't work the way you say it does. > > I'll use {{champion:17}} as an example because I think it's immediately obvious how Luden's would work. > You seem to be suggesting that- if an Ally of mine walks into a Teemo shroom, I will get poisoned if only the Luden's splash hits me. But again, almost 100% positive that this isn't the case. > > Runes like Ravenous Hunter obviously apply because the bonus damage from Luden's is still "damage dealt". So after ALL damage is applied, then the % Healing is considered. > Another equally silly argument would be "The extra shots from {{item:3085}} shouldn't apply Lifesteal." Op is right about how it works, i regularly build ludens into liandries on gragas, and if my barrel procs ludens off a minion onto the enemy they also get burned by liandries
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oNc93Xe5,comment-id=000b00000000,timestamp=2019-12-05T02:51:25.263+0000) > > furthermore the accounts of junglers being "3-4" lvls behind are grossly exaggerated, its about 1 1/2 to 2 levels. The only junglers who are falling significantly behind are the type i mentioned, No, it's just a lot of laners haven't figured out how to farm correctly on the new map. Video below has Doinb 8 levels above the opposing JG and 5 levels above his JG. Pretty much the only way for JG to not fall behind is successfully ganking then taxing solo lanes. If you watch high elo streamers this is pretty much how all the pros are playing ATM pick Elise/Lee perma gank and tax. [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgqmqM7Bj1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgqmqM7Bj1s)
> [{quoted}](name=Worst JG Wins,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oNc93Xe5,comment-id=000b000000000001,timestamp=2019-12-05T13:22:01.362+0000) > > No, it's just a lot of laners haven't figured out how to farm correctly on the new map. Video below has Doinb 8 levels above the opposing JG and 5 levels above his JG. Pretty much the only way for JG to not fall behind is successfully ganking then taxing solo lanes. If you watch high elo streamers this is pretty much how all the pros are playing ATM pick Elise/Lee perma gank and tax. > > [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgqmqM7Bj1s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TgqmqM7Bj1s) If you actually watch the gameplay hes literally taking almost all the jungle camps while solo laning, of course both junglers are going to be many levels under him, hes also on ryze a pick which is notorious for sidelaning/farming the xp/gold advantage hard. I would not call this indicative Of the average game at all.
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oNc93Xe5,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2019-12-05T00:14:39.008+0000) > > Junglers now have more influence then ever. The reality is that prior to the changes junglers were actively being rewarded for bad gameplay habits. Camped a lane for four straight minutes just to get one kill? Doesnt matter that you idled not killing jungle for 2 of those minutes, catchup xp would reward your shitty play after you got your laner ahead by sheer brute force play. Its better this way, junglers have just as much influence as before, if not more, they iust can’t faceroll their way through a game. gank meta = super bad underleveled jungler meta = super bad BOTH BAD! hope that was simple to understand ;)
> [{quoted}](name=BONUS DMG 2NOOBS,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=oNc93Xe5,comment-id=000b0000,timestamp=2019-12-05T00:43:21.473+0000) > > gank meta = super bad > underleveled jungler meta = super bad > > BOTH BAD! > hope that was simple to understand ;) being of lesser level than the solos is not the same thing as being "under leveled", it never made sense that jungles were lvling as fast as, or in some cases faster than the solos, considering the impact they have mapwide, including the securing of objectives such as dragon. furthermore the accounts of junglers being "3-4" lvls behind are grossly exaggerated, its about 1 1/2 to 2 levels. The only junglers who are falling significantly behind are the type i mentioned, the ones who rely on bad habit spam ganks that eventually work because you eventually blow the laners flash and just loop around, and go back to catchup XP. The ONLY way people are falling behind by 3-4 lvls as Jungle is if you fall behind from bad gank attempts and your team is doing bad.
: GJ Riot you somehow made the Jungle determines games situation worse
Junglers now have more influence then ever. The reality is that prior to the changes junglers were actively being rewarded for bad gameplay habits. Camped a lane for four straight minutes just to get one kill? Doesnt matter that you idled not killing jungle for 2 of those minutes, catchup xp would reward your shitty play after you got your laner ahead by sheer brute force play. Its better this way, junglers have just as much influence as before, if not more, they iust can’t faceroll their way through a game.
: Her numbers are much closer to "too strong" than on the side of "awkwardly awful." Q-auto at level 1 does 25 + 40 + 39 + 20 = 124 magic damage from a single spell even starting {{item:1054}} and without Absolute Focus, and this can be recast two additional times for that same damage in addition to the base 62.4 x 3 = 187 damage from the autos themselves. Most spells from most champions at the same level deal around 75 + 10 damage on a cooldown four times as long.
> [{quoted}](name=PopcornBunni,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pPZRU5Je,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-12-01T20:42:57.444+0000) > > Her numbers are much closer to "too strong" than on the side of "awkwardly awful." > > Q-auto at level 1 does 65 + 39 + 20 = 124 magic damage from a single spell even starting {{item:1054}} and without Absolute Focus, and this can be recast two additional times for that same damage in addition to the base 62.4 x 3 = 187 damage from the autos themselves. > > Most spells from most champions at the same level deal around 75 + 10 damage on a cooldown four times as long. ^ this, her numbers are actually kind of absurd when you consider that she runs D shield and FF
: As a 600k Soraka main the very existence of Senna is just a slap in the face
> [{quoted}](name=SaltyToplaneGoat,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=YL6bpilf,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-12-01T01:38:51.840+0000) > > As Soraka in lane you literally have to kill yourself to heal and also get in enemy range to get that back up - and stars beware you EVER get to deal ANY damage or have ANY sort of real CC. This was for balancing they said, you get to be "THE HEALER" for those tradeoffs. So Soraka brings to the table: a heal, a delayed hard cc, and a global ult to help out in other lanes. > > Meanwhile Senna gets all that, AND her shroud, AND damage, AND carry potential, AND a specific AD-Supp item, AND free stats.... > > What exactly was the point of hitting on my poor healgoat so hard when in turn you give Senna a free pass? Right now I have the most success with taking her to toplane and then abusing the power of a spammable range slow combined with sustain as well as the fact that E is an instant damage cast that's hard to avoid. I literally have to pick THE HEALER-CHAMPION for everything in her kit that's NOT HEALING. Meanwhile Senna... > > And it feels even more like she was just made to spite support mains for the fact that her entire kit completly lacks internal synergy. NONE of her abilities actually work with each other in a relevant way. It's just a pile of "how much bullshit can we randomly stack on this champion and oh wait and let's give her enough extra-healing on the side that she can out-perform a Soraka during lane-phase". Look even the most basic champions have at least SOME sort of internal plays going on, from the typical "hit your skillshot then follow up" to "weave your basic attacks right between abilities" depending what sort of champ it is. Meanwhile Senna does... nothing of that sort. You can click your Q wherever, none of your kit actually cares if you hit that E or not, and none of your skills is in any way connected to the cloud. > > And to top it all off: the clunky attack animation that just feels REALLY weird combined with the fact that she just does not fulfill the "I got the BIG GUN!" fantasy that comes with such weaponary. You should have just made her a mage, sort of a cross between Ezreal, Veigar, and Xerath... but like this? Just bad design. Turns out that "needs to dou lane with lucian and have references to him and thresh" is NOT a solid basis for actual good design who could have known?! Next time base your goals on actual gameplay and don't take a lazy shortcut because then THIS happens. > > Tl,dr for Senna: looks good visually, fails miserable mechanically - and that failure has to be grossly overcompensated with free stats and other nonsense that's just insulting to everyone who actually plays a "normal" champ. I dont think that the range on sennas heal is really an issue considering sorakas heal is more potent. What i will say is sennas root has way too long a range, she basically has the same playmaking ability as a hook support except she can do it from the backline. I doubt theyll rework her this early but, if it were me, id nix the range on root by 1/2 or 1/3, rework the auto attack to be more normal and maybe nerf her scaling passive a tad. Also maybe get rid of her Q interaction with wards which seems kinda cheese
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=afqItML8,comment-id=00010001000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-28T04:01:13.863+0000) > > you know you're being disingenuous, when you say akali has little mobility. yeah she has her e, which is a dash away and a dash back, she has her R, she has a massive speed boost on her passive, and a massive speed boost on her shroud, this is all discounting the slipperiness she gets on shroud. All that paired with the fact that she has enough inherent burst in her kit that she gets to run Fleet Footwork instead of electrocute unlike pretty much every other character that plays even remotely similar to her. > > when you pair that with the fact that she has an EXTREMELY safe laning phase due to the fact of the aforementioned fleet footwork mixed with the fact that shes an AP scaling manaless champion which allows her to use doran's shield instead of ring. > > theres really no way to defend the safety of playing akali or try to derail the idea that shes mobile, shes very mobile. > > you're right that shes not the MOST mobile, but when she is as sufficiently mobile as she is, does it really make sense that she gets true stealth on top of it? no it fucking doesnt. > > unlike other people here im not even suggesting they mess with the stealth on shroud, but her moblity on top of that makes her way too safe. I'd agree if you took it in a vacuum like you want me too.. however, a vast majority of champs can easily counter her... 1) Her shroud is hella easy to dodge around, once she sets it, run away. GG. Then punish her severely for it... 2) The movement speed bonus isn't doing anything for her unless you let her abuse it. Even a weak slow not only nullifies it, but punishes her heavily... Most champs these days have some form of hard cc though. 3) She mostly faces champs with point and click AOE skills, or mages again with point and click and easy AOE, skillshots that even in the shroud can easily punish her, and you can keep poking her from a ways away... 4) Her only real mobility that makes any real difference (again if you're playing against her correctly), is her E, and ult... And lets talk about her ult for a second, not only has it been nerfed a few times, it still has a asinine cool down on it.. Every champion she goes up against her ult is almost double the time of theirs (in some cases double or triple the time of theirs), and that's where a majority of her kill potential comes from. 5) Just because she can play safely, doesn't mean that = a winning lane, or even a winning game.. Not by a long shot.. Meanwhile, Zed, Yasuo, any mage, and quite honestly vast majority of any champs besides melee's can play even safer than akali... I don't care what you or anyone else says, Akali is hands down the most balanced champ in the game.. Even against champions she's supposed to "counter" has multitude of ways to outplay her, and cancel her... No other champ in the game can claim this.. Champs Yasuo, zed, and other supposed "overloaded kits" literally crap all over the champs they counter and there's almost nothing those champs can do to stop them.. Meanwhile with Akali, if you know how to work around her kit, (which is easy), you almost naturally counter her ability to kill you.. Zed again for example.. requires you to buy zhonya's if you dont want to blow up in .5 seconds, and that's without him being fed.. Even if you "win lane" against him, you don't.. Because unlike Akali, he can poke you down with his shadows for free, and take cs that way with ease. Zed is just one example but there are many of them.
> [{quoted}](name=KnightLakega,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=afqItML8,comment-id=000100010000000000000001,timestamp=2019-11-28T15:20:44.772+0000) > > I'd agree if you took it in a vacuum like you want me too.. however, a vast majority of champs can easily counter her... > > 1) Her shroud is hella easy to dodge around, once she sets it, run away. GG. Then punish her severely for it... > > 2) The movement speed bonus isn't doing anything for her unless you let her abuse it. Even a weak slow not only nullifies it, but punishes her heavily... Most champs these days have some form of hard cc though. > > 3) She mostly faces champs with point and click AOE skills, or mages again with point and click and easy AOE, skillshots that even in the shroud can easily punish her, and you can keep poking her from a ways away... > > 4) Her only real mobility that makes any real difference (again if you're playing against her correctly), is her E, and ult... > > And lets talk about her ult for a second, not only has it been nerfed a few times, it still has a asinine cool down on it.. Every champion she goes up against her ult is almost double the time of theirs (in some cases double or triple the time of theirs), and that's where a majority of her kill potential comes from. > > 5) Just because she can play safely, doesn't mean that = a winning lane, or even a winning game.. Not by a long shot.. Meanwhile, Zed, Yasuo, any mage, and quite honestly vast majority of any champs besides melee's can play even safer than akali... > > I don't care what you or anyone else says, Akali is hands down the most balanced champ in the game.. Even against champions she's supposed to "counter" has multitude of ways to outplay her, and cancel her... No other champ in the game can claim this.. > > Champs Yasuo, zed, and other supposed "overloaded kits" literally crap all over the champs they counter and there's almost nothing those champs can do to stop them.. Meanwhile with Akali, if you know how to work around her kit, (which is easy), you almost naturally counter her ability to kill you.. > > Zed again for example.. requires you to buy zhonya's if you dont want to blow up in .5 seconds, and that's without him being fed.. Even if you "win lane" against him, you don't.. Because unlike Akali, he can poke you down with his shadows for free, and take cs that way with ease. > > Zed is just one example but there are many of them. What makes tou think in talking about her using shroud offensively? My main shtick with it is that it gives you way to much safety, its like ganking a zed when he has Shadow up, the main difference being zed actually needs Shadow to deal damage, whereas akali doesnt need shroud to do damage and can just keep it pocketed for bad situations. The only champion that i consider to have a safer laning phase mid is morgana. Imo if you die in lane phase on either of these characters outside of you roaming, you’re automatically terrible in my book, as both these champions have an “i dont die in lane phase” lane phase. As for your comparison with zed, you talk about how akali is “so easy to counter” and talk about hpw broken zeds shadow is for “free poke” but you dont even know how abuseable zed is in lane once shadow is on CD which starts with a 22 sec cool down. Trust me when i say laning phase is just as bad for champions countered by akali as every other mid lane counter.
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=afqItML8,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2019-11-27T21:25:58.417+0000) > > She has way too much inherent mobility in her kit, i would have said to remove the move speed from her passive instead of shroud because its way more of a problem, but im fair and know she needs that to trade properly in lane. > Her e already gets her out of bad situations and she already has a dash on her R and movespeed on passive, and shroud means she can literally sit untouched in a fight or a gank for extended periods, she really doesn't need an additional dashback on e or more movespeed in shroud. All these things mixed with zhonyas and flash make her way too hard to pin down. As for her Q, im of firm belief that abilities that have low cd’s and no mana cost should take a more backloaded approach where most of the damage comes from comboing with something else. It really doesnt make sense that her q does decent damage alone when she can literally spam it non stop. Dude.. She has some mobility, not alot.. Zed has way more, Ekko, leblanc has like 9x her range on multiple skills.. Akali is extremely simple to know how to counter her.. Stay away from her shround, when she puts it down, back off. Fight her when her shroud is on cool down she's extremely vulnerable.. Her only mobility is in her E, literally 1 skill not counting her ult, which also has a 2 second cd between the second use.. She is so easy to pin down.. When you see her E you, wait fo r her to press it again and bind her half way in, she has to come straight at you.. She's extremely vulnerable, and extremely easy to pin down and blow up, unlike zed, ekko, leblanc, and a plethora of other champs... Hell Shaco is 10x more difficult to peg down because he has true stealth and can travel anywhere, and he gets a clone to trick you easily to get away, with a built in blink on his stealth.. YOu want to talk about overloaded assassins that are too safe? Zed, Shaco, and leblanc need to be looked at before Akali gets touched.
> [{quoted}](name=KnightLakega,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=afqItML8,comment-id=0001000100000000,timestamp=2019-11-28T02:55:39.630+0000) > > Dude.. She has some mobility, not alot.. Zed has way more, Ekko, leblanc has like 9x her range on multiple skills.. > > Akali is extremely simple to know how to counter her.. Stay away from her shround, when she puts it down, back off. Fight her when her shroud is on cool down she's extremely vulnerable.. > > Her only mobility is in her E, literally 1 skill not counting her ult, which also has a 2 second cd between the second use.. She is so easy to pin down.. When you see her E you, wait fo r her to press it again and bind her half way in, she has to come straight at you.. > > She's extremely vulnerable, and extremely easy to pin down and blow up, unlike zed, ekko, leblanc, and a plethora of other champs... > > Hell Shaco is 10x more difficult to peg down because he has true stealth and can travel anywhere, and he gets a clone to trick you easily to get away, with a built in blink on his stealth.. > > YOu want to talk about overloaded assassins that are too safe? Zed, Shaco, and leblanc need to be looked at before Akali gets touched. you know you're being disingenuous, when you say akali has little mobility. yeah she has her e, which is a dash away and a dash back, she has her R, she has a massive speed boost on her passive, and a massive speed boost on her shroud, this is all discounting the slipperiness she gets on shroud. All that paired with the fact that she has enough inherent burst in her kit that she gets to run Fleet Footwork instead of electrocute unlike pretty much every other character that plays even remotely similar to her. when you pair that with the fact that she has an EXTREMELY safe laning phase due to the fact of the aforementioned fleet footwork mixed with the fact that shes an AP scaling manaless champion which allows her to use doran's shield instead of ring. theres really no way to defend the safety of playing akali or try to derail the idea that shes mobile, shes very mobile. you're right that shes not the MOST mobile, but when she is as sufficiently mobile as she is, does it really make sense that she gets true stealth on top of it? no it fucking doesnt. unlike other people here im not even suggesting they mess with the stealth on shroud, but her moblity on top of that makes her way too safe.
: > [{quoted}](name=Abibyama II,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Rn3mEAW7,comment-id=000100010000,timestamp=2019-11-25T10:57:19.078+0000) > > https://youtu.be/vIDIQfxX_ZA > > :D HAHAHAHAHAHAH TANKS ARE FUCKIGN ABD RIGHT>?>>???
> [{quoted}](name=GodlyBane,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Rn3mEAW7,comment-id=0001000100000005,timestamp=2019-11-28T01:08:50.874+0000) > > HAHAHAHAHAHAH TANKS ARE FUCKIGN ABD RIGHT>?>>??? I mean, its a 1v1 between two very bad players, one being an ornn with cloud soul and very obviously a fuck ton of armor
iiGazeii (NA)
: If Aphelios was the same as other champions with similar weapons, I'd agree with you, but during his limited windows, he's better than other champs at that thing. His waveclear with Infernum is near-instant. His range with Calibrum is easily over 600. His DPS with Crescendum is insane. His root with Gravitum is consistent and has a hefty duration. The Severum healing is massive. He's overall stronger than other ADCs at everything, he just doesn't get to pick what two things he's good at.
> [{quoted}](name=iiGazeii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=9Rfm1EYE,comment-id=000200000001,timestamp=2019-11-27T22:19:50.417+0000) > > If Aphelios was the same as other champions with similar weapons, I'd agree with you, but during his limited windows, he's better than other champs at that thing. > > His waveclear with Infernum is near-instant. His range with Calibrum is easily over 600. His DPS with Crescendum is insane. His root with Gravitum is consistent and has a hefty duration. The Severum healing is massive. > > He's overall stronger than other ADCs at everything, he just doesn't get to pick what two things he's good at. After reading up on him and seeing him play im convinced that an attack speed CDR build would allow him cycle through particular combinations quickly and efficiently
: > [{quoted}](name=Deecoyy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7ekJKLV7,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-11-27T06:17:36.621+0000) > > I'm not sure if it's working as intended, but if you build a BotRK and Ornn uprgrades it into a MotRK, and you build another BotRK afterwards, the on-hit % current health damage stacks to an insane 16% current health damage on-hit. I wasn't recording, but I played against a kog'maw as ADC, and with him having both Ruined King items, and in the death recap, he did 300 damage with AA's + abilities, and did over 800 with items. I was playing twitch, and didn't build any health, and he only auto'd me 3 times. That much on-hit damage from items can only be explained by the supposedly "unique" passive on the items stacking because of it not being a named passive, and the items being technically two different items. Omg! Trying this on Vayne
> [{quoted}](name=Düff McWhalen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=7ekJKLV7,comment-id=000b,timestamp=2019-11-27T20:12:09.777+0000) > > Omg! Trying this on Vayne Thats just dirty....thats what...if you account for the current health stipulation like 70% max hp in 3 hits excluding base attack damage
: holy crap, you guys are trying to actually obliterate the champion, and the fact that you got upvoted so much is sad . No wonder riot stays away from boards.
> [{quoted}](name=SpongebobIsLife,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=afqItML8,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2019-11-27T21:11:56.900+0000) > > holy crap, you guys are trying to actually obliterate the champion, and the fact that you got upvoted so much is sad . > > No wonder riot stays away from boards. She has way too much inherent mobility in her kit, i would have said to remove the move speed from her passive instead of shroud because its way more of a problem, but im fair and know she needs that to trade properly in lane. Her e already gets her out of bad situations and she already has a dash on her R and movespeed on passive, and shroud means she can literally sit untouched in a fight or a gank for extended periods, she really doesn't need an additional dashback on e or more movespeed in shroud. All these things mixed with zhonyas and flash make her way too hard to pin down. As for her Q, im of firm belief that abilities that have low cd’s and no mana cost should take a more backloaded approach where most of the damage comes from comboing with something else. It really doesnt make sense that her q does decent damage alone when she can literally spam it non stop.
: There NEEDS to be some kind of counter to Akali's smokescreen
> [{quoted}](name=Düff McWhalen,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=afqItML8,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-11-27T19:12:11.865+0000) > > But you can't go back to her being countered by Pink Wards either. Akali is way too safe with that shroud but without it she's garbage. What's the solution? shrouds only an issue because of the rest of her kit being cancer. Imo lower the base damage on q so that she actually has to melee you for damage, get rid of the second activation on E and remove the move speed off shroud and she will be fine.
: As someone who disagrees with many of your points in detail, I'd like to go over each point that I disagree with, and attempt to back up my positions with evidence. I hope this could be useful for creating a discussion. Firstly, I'd like to debate your point on tanks being less tanky now than before. Your main point on this was that the health % execute on elder dragon and the lethality makes tanks weaker. This is pretty much demonstrably false as far as I can tell. As a top lane main who's been using conqueror-only champions since it came out, I can attest that tanks are **substantially** tankier now than they've ever been. I main Fiora, and from personal experience, it seems very clear to me that tanks are tankier, even for Fiora. In terms of objective evidence, it seems clear that the winrates for tanks overall has gone up pretty substantially in platinum+ elo, and there's actually a meta tank in play in the top lane as of now in Ornn (something that quite frankly hasn't been the case for this entire year). Mind you, no changes were made to tanks directly. Their itemization is largely the same, and we saw no systematic buff to the class. It's literally just Conqueror as far as I can tell. To the elder dragon point, I find that in practice, the buff is so rarely taken that it's a non-issue in terms of tank balance. You can disagree, but that's my take. It's not as though the buff necessarily hurts tanks more than any other class of champion functionally. Secondly, I'd like to talk about your point on dragons being "more important than ever". Statistically, every dragon type gives worse stats now than it did before the preseason. That's just a fact. In compensation, there are the dragon souls. However, these are practically a non-issue for any team to worry about until the enemy team takes _at least_ two dragons. In the early game, I truly believe that teams are over-prioritizing a dragon buff that A) gives worse buffs individually than before; and B) only pays off once the opponent kills a total of 4 dragons. I truly believe, based on the evidence, that dragons only serve as a win condition that can't pay off until at best, 26 minutes in the game given that a team can kill all 4 as quickly as possible. The stats alone simply aren't anywhere good enough to make dragons truly meaningful until the soul is an option. In terms of jungle health with tanks, I disagree that damage junglers will naturally become dominant. It's worth noting now that damage junglers have been meta ever since the Sejuani and tank jungle nerfs that delayed the Warmog's build. That was a very damaging nerf to tanks in a game where tanks already weren't particularly welcome (due to Conqueror true damage). With that said, I see no reason why traditional tank junglers can't be effective in this meta. For one, they're just tankier due to changes I've already mentioned. Secondly, these champions are designed with efficient clear speed in mind. Sejuani isn't an awful drake taker, she can do it just fine. Many tank junglers are simply better than their damage counterparts at contesting major objectives (Nunu comes to mind). I'm of the belief that the class needs buffs in the jungle in order to better compete, but that's something that wasn't caused by this preseason at the very least. Lastly, I'd like to give light to some evidence that suggests that lethality users are worse off now than before the changes. And that's simply in terms of win rates. If we analyze platinum+ elo, practically every single lethality user has seen a hit in their wr%. Although it doesn't seem obvious why this is the case, I think it's because they scale worse and are forced to itemize into items that they really don't want because lethality stacking is far less efficient than it used to be. In terms of the meta of solo queue, I think it's very natural for players to lean towards higher-impact champions. Unfortunately, tanks have never fit the bill as being high-impact champions; and this has been the case since I started playing in season 2. They've always been lower-impact champions because they have substantially less agency in who dies and when. That's just how they work, and to change that would destroy the tank class (I imagine we could agree there). And in terms of these carry-oriented supports, it's worth noting that before Pyke and Senna, the vast majority of support-intended champions were designed as defensive, utility based champions. I think it's finally time to create a new win condition for the support role in League of Legends that includes doing lots of damage and being an active damage carry, rather than being shoehorned into a defensive, utility oriented playstyle. Of course, this is coming from a top laner so take my words with a grain of salt when I start to talk about support. Those are just my two cents on some of the issues you brought up. Again, I hope this can create a useful dialogue / conversation. Thanks for reading.
> [{quoted}](name=Usernamehere1235,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Rn3mEAW7,comment-id=001f,timestamp=2019-11-26T09:54:53.323+0000) > > As someone who disagrees with many of your points in detail, I'd like to go over each point that I disagree with, and attempt to back up my positions with evidence. I hope this could be useful for creating a discussion. > > Firstly, I'd like to debate your point on tanks being less tanky now than before. Your main point on this was that the health % execute on elder dragon and the lethality makes tanks weaker. This is pretty much demonstrably false as far as I can tell. As a top lane main who's been using conqueror-only champions since it came out, I can attest that tanks are **substantially** tankier now than they've ever been. I couldn’t imagine anything being further from the truth, and its surprising hearing this coming from someone who’s been around almost as long as i have. The first thing to note is that health pools among tankier champs are significantly lower than they were then, back then i could easily breach 3.6k hp without even building warmogs, it wasnt uncommon to see 4/10 players have 4.3-4.5 k hp. Almost all of the tank items had 10-15 points more of their respective resistance type, resulting in 40-60 more points of defensive stat at full build. Force of nature also existed. While the early seasons had madreds razors, percent hp damage was significantly sparser. There was no liandries, there was no jungle razor, there was no bork. Ways to increase your damage against higher health targets like LDR also did not exist. Back when DFG existed it was constantly complained about because of how bursty it was until it was removed, but now items like duskblade and ludens exist in literally every build and no one bats an eye. I get that they do less famage than DFG did, but these items don’t exist in a vacuum and so we will proceed. Before the first mastery revamp, summoner setups werent near as impactful as they are now. We got the first revamp which had thunderlords and the keystones and pages we currently have frontload alot more burst into peoples combos than the first rune pages and mastery ever did. Even the resolve tree is distinctly hybridized in its “defense” approach which includes keystones that actually deal damage. All this paired with the fact that anti tank mechanics are slapped onto literally every other kit, i remember back in the day when the only champs i had to worry about shredding through a tank like paper were brand, vayne and to some extent malzahar(post madreds stacking of course) now we have more than double the amount of champs with tank shredding mechanics in their kit. All this paired with CDR creep making it so everyone has 30-40% CDR and even more on their ulti in some cases, and the fact that during season 1-3 squishies that werent adc’s used tabis and mercs who now use pen boots and ionias instead. As for the dragon buffs, it was obvious that they benefitted offense more during s9, as for now i think it benefits defense and offense equally, with the exception of elder which landslides it back to offense. There is also the role switching of bveil and GA that used to be tank items, the Tmail rework, and the adding of two more grievous wounds items in morello and the tmail rework.which made regen and healing alot weaker One last thing id like to add is the removal of broad range spell vamp And lowered effectiveness of lifesteal which when removed made both adc’s and mages opt to more glass cannon builds. When you add all these things together i dont think you can honestly say that tanks are the tankiest theyve been or damage is the lowest its been.
: I am prolly wrong about it's uselessness, but even if we assume the current sanguine is overpowered, it doesn't matter. ALL items can be tweaked to be op. If wit's end gave +1000 attack damage and +1000 ability power, everyone would build it because it's overpowered. Numbers in any item can be tweaked to make an item overpowered or useless. My main qualm with sanguine blade is it's passive rewarding poor vision control. I'd entertain ideas why it should be left alone, but it being overpowered/useless is that last thing you should judge an item for. That doesn't determines whether it's fun, engaging, or improves how champions play. As it is, sanguine blade seems it will always have to be balanced on the small pool of champions that can abuse it. This will happen until the item is either bad for everyone, or mediocre on the best users of it. Black Cleaver went through this, BoRK went through this, etc. Do you think my suggestion (ignoring all numbers) would reduce the number of champions that use it, make it less fun to use, or be bad in general? if so, why?
> [{quoted}](name=Beesafree,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=bEyQvEL1,comment-id=00020000,timestamp=2019-11-25T06:20:12.068+0000) > > I am prolly wrong about it's uselessness, but even if we assume the current sanguine is overpowered, it doesn't matter. ALL items can be tweaked to be op. If wit's end gave +1000 attack damage and +1000 ability power, everyone would build it because it's overpowered. Numbers in any item can be tweaked to make an item overpowered or useless. My main qualm with sanguine blade is it's passive rewarding poor vision control. > > I'd entertain ideas why it should be left alone, but it being overpowered/useless is that last thing you should judge an item for. That doesn't determines whether it's fun, engaging, or improves how champions play. As it is, sanguine blade seems it will always have to be balanced on the small pool of champions that can abuse it. This will happen until the item is either bad for everyone, or mediocre on the best users of it. Black Cleaver went through this, BoRK went through this, etc. > > Do you think my suggestion (ignoring all numbers) would reduce the number of champions that use it, make it less fun to use, or be bad in general? if so, why? i don't believe that your suggestion is appropriate, not because its too weak or too strong, but because it is not in keeping with the items intended purpose. that isn't to say the current live iteration is any better, the item is being abused by ranged tops and both topside bruisers and junglers. the item was originally intended to be used by assassins and AD casters to give them more split pushing/side laning potential, which is why its passive trafficks in mostly attack speed despite being a lethality item, the issue with your suggestion is that it makes this item into a distinctly anti personnel item. that's not to say that the current version of the item isnt anti personnel, but rather that's not the only reason its overpowered nor was it the original design intent. currently it's too strong because not only does it make certain champs broken in terms of split pushing, but it basically requires that you send at least 2 people to deal with the user and leads to near untenable levels of lane pressure, particularly if the enemy runs 1 3 1 with two sanguine users. if im being honest, i dunno how to fix it to make it function properly and not be overpowered, ill have to stew it over for a bit
: Sanguine Blade review and suggestion
Sanguine blade is easily the strongest item ingame right now, it solidifies an already valid strategy of split pushing and requires you to send 2 players to deal with the threat no matter what, certain champs are extra broken with it, like nocturne
Yenn (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d5td3vMw,comment-id=001400000000,timestamp=2019-11-23T08:46:32.392+0000) > > If your 4 levels under as the jg, you're jungling wrong. > > Junglers shouldn't be scaling on the same level as the solos, at least early, they have too much influence on the map for that to be balanced If they don't stay close to solo lanes, we run into the problem of the solo lanes just invading them 24/7 for easy kills.
> [{quoted}](name=Yenn,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d5td3vMw,comment-id=0014000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-24T02:29:12.086+0000) > > If they don't stay close to solo lanes, we run into the problem of the solo lanes just invading them 24/7 for easy kills. except that if they invade in that manner they will end up losing their lanes from missing farm and XP, the only place where this is really an issue is for scuttle contest. It's also quite funny when junglers complain when the shoe is on the other foot, for many laners junglers not only being of the same level and having buffs on them+ certain things like the predator keystone, made it excessively difficult to avoid getting ganked or at the very least blowing flash, it wasn't fair, and yet as soon as you guys start leveling slower you get all worried about laners invading your jungle which covers half the map. it's not like most teams are deep warding your entire jungle 5 minutes in, they don't have the resources for that, so all this "omg they are gunna invade me" is just one giant boogeyman
Abrosis (NA)
: This jungle nerf is awful right now. It makes so many junglers obsolete. Because of the xp nerfs you're going to get outscaled by any top or mid as long as they sit in their lane. The dont even need to farm better or get any kills and they will outscale you. It takes 1 decent mid laner to get a small lead, run it down bot for an easy double kill, and then secure drag uncontested because what are you going to do? That mid laner has 4 levels on the jungler.
> [{quoted}](name=Abrosis,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=d5td3vMw,comment-id=00140000,timestamp=2019-11-23T04:45:51.649+0000) > > This jungle nerf is awful right now. It makes so many junglers obsolete. Because of the xp nerfs you're going to get outscaled by any top or mid as long as they sit in their lane. The dont even need to farm better or get any kills and they will outscale you. It takes 1 decent mid laner to get a small lead, run it down bot for an easy double kill, and then secure drag uncontested because what are you going to do? That mid laner has 4 levels on the jungler. If your 4 levels under as the jg, you're jungling wrong. Junglers shouldn't be scaling on the same level as the solos, at least early, they have too much influence on the map for that to be balanced
: A Rune then give u all Keystone (Not Broken) 😂
> [{quoted}](name=Thorn Fierce Red,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZdjvskHA,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-11-22T15:46:36.757+0000) > > Prototype: Omnistone > Play {{champion:14}} feel like Thanos > Press the Attack > Lethal Tempo > Fleet Footwork > Conqueror > Summon Aery > Arcane Comet > Phase Rush > Electrocute > Predator (only if you have boots) > Dark Harvest (souls amplify the effects of all keystones) > Hail of Blades > Grasp of the Undying > Aftershock (only if you can trigger it on a basic ability) > Glacial Augment But omnistone is the worst keystone in the game....
Myrmiron (EUW)
: LUL season 2 support was op as fuck. I know because I mained it and had 70-80% winrate on Soraka and Janna.
> [{quoted}](name=Myrmiron,realm=EUW,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=vV8Wkexg,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-11-22T19:22:49.221+0000) > > LUL season 2 support was op as fuck. I know because I mained it and had 70-80% winrate on Soraka and Janna. That ezreal sona bot, soraka mid sustain poke comp...no fighting, just sending people b over and over.... that was fun
Yenn (NA)
: Jungle EXP really needs to be revisited
I dont get what people are complaining about, junglers just exchanged solo power for more mapwide influence, and mapwide/macro influence is sorta the point of the jungle role. The only junglers for which this is a nerf are the junglers who spam unsuccessful ganks on lanes just to be a nuisance to the opposig laners and expect NOT to get punished for failing because of catchup XP. If you have skill, the jungle is arguably better now, if you suck and literally relied on catchup xp to cushion your lack of skill, then yeah its worse. Realistically, anyone with a brain should realize that it wasn’t really fair for junglers to have equivalent solo power to solo laners considering how much more mapwide influence and pressure junglers contribute to the game, especially if you compare the jungle role to toplane in s9
: {{champion:142}} {{champion:81}} {{champion:9}} {{champion:74}} {{champion:17}} {{champion:161}} All can reliably use Omnistone
> [{quoted}](name=Illabethe,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PZThd0F7,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-11-22T11:01:38.626+0000) > > {{champion:142}} {{champion:81}} {{champion:9}} {{champion:74}} {{champion:17}} {{champion:161}} All can reliably use Omnistone I would never ever use this keystone on zoe fiddle or vel, like why would you do that when it means you inevitably cycle through PTA, FF, HOB and grasp? Also pred isn't too hot for fiddle or vel either, tho it could be beneficial for Zoe.
: People dont seem to understand that this key stone is meant for champs who can benefit from multiple key stones AND would benefit from having those key stones on a LOWER COOLDOWN. People forget that part of the keystone. You dont just get electrocute and have to wait for the cd of electracute to come back up you just swap to another key stone. There is so much potential in this key stone that people dont realize because its random and forget the cooldowns lower Klepto was a completly dumb key stone and just served as a gold generation keystone for passive play styles. It added nothing to gameplay that was meaningful this does
> [{quoted}](name=Demented Lemur,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=PZThd0F7,comment-id=0014,timestamp=2019-11-22T17:48:29.188+0000) > > People dont seem to understand that this key stone is meant for champs who can benefit from multiple key stones AND would benefit from having those key stones on a LOWER COOLDOWN. People forget that part of the keystone. You dont just get electrocute and have to wait for the cd of electracute to come back up you just swap to another key stone. > > There is so much potential in this key stone that people dont realize because its random and forget the cooldowns lower > > Klepto was a completly dumb key stone and just served as a gold generation keystone for passive play styles. It added nothing to gameplay that was meaningful this does The problem is that for most champions roughly half the keystones are either sub optimal or downright useless, and its not just a chance of you getting a shit rune, because it forcibly cycles thtough all of them. To top it all off, it can proc runes like dark harvest and grasp which function corely off their ability to scale through stacks.
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZNJFQh5h,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T02:08:19.632+0000) > > Im not a jungle player, im a mid otp, i just tried jg out for the past week to see what it was like... Then why bother defending them? We, mid players, should rejoice with jg being put into their own place, they have been broken for so long its only fair.
> [{quoted}](name=Anime Fizz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZNJFQh5h,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T02:20:11.697+0000) > > Then why bother defending them? We, mid players, should rejoice with jg being put into their own place, they have been broken for so long its only fair. i never said i was unhappy about the changes, i just said that i think its botlane thats freelo, not jungle
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZNJFQh5h,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-11-21T00:26:20.555+0000) > > Tbh i feel like bot lane was more freelo then jg. Theoretically jg had more influence, but only in so far as funneling power into bot. I tried taking up jungling for that reason and found that, while a bot lane can compensate for a bad jungler, a jungler cant compensate for a bad botlane. > > In my little role experiment i found that it didnt matter how many kills you funneled into a subpar botlane, as soon as you left them alone for ten seconds they would lose you the game. Jungle player trying to defend their previously broken role. Good riddance! hopefully now you'll have to learn how to play the game to get wins as jg.
> [{quoted}](name=Anime Fizz,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZNJFQh5h,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-11-21T01:32:20.896+0000) > > Jungle player trying to defend their previously broken role. > > Good riddance! hopefully now you'll have to learn how to play the game to get wins as jg. Im not a jungle player, im a mid otp, i just tried jg out for the past week to see what it was like...
: So.. IMO post, Do you guys agree? if or if not explain :)
> [{quoted}](name=Pumpedhero,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=ZvhdLOOT,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-11-20T22:44:23.123+0000) > > The xp nerfs are absolutely overkill and gut bot / jng, tanks feel less tanky (mainly playing voli rn and he doesnt feel like he has any sustain or stats at all compared to say lee), the dragon environmental changes need to be revamp and made useful, like how earth and inferal work, cloud and ocean are very dull and useless unless ur playing a very specific champion that can use said dragon. Haven't played too many games today, like 4 or 5.. I just feel that this is a very unhealthy and a punishment for roles.. Specially the XP nerfs.. jesus its terrible. I main adc and i havent even touch bot at all due to playing jng and already feeling how bad and how behind I am compared to others. Bot lane and jg needed a nerf, somewhere down the line riot forgot the intended use of the different roles. Solo laners were supposed to be for early and mid game dominance, bottom was for lategame dominance through scaling, and jg was for securing important objectives for teamwide benefits. For the past few years jg and bot got to have the advantages their roles bring but also take away the advantages solo laners were supposed to have, now the proper order has been restored.
: Seems like snowballing solo laners are unstoppable now
Tbh i feel like bot lane was more freelo then jg. Theoretically jg had more influence, but only in so far as funneling power into bot. I tried taking up jungling for that reason and found that, while a bot lane can compensate for a bad jungler, a jungler cant compensate for a bad botlane. In my little role experiment i found that it didnt matter how many kills you funneled into a subpar botlane, as soon as you left them alone for ten seconds they would lose you the game.
Rioter Comments
: And so if a with 20 marksmen banned the adc role wont exist. Or how about we ban every prevalent top laner aside from our first pick so the enemy has to go {{champion:48}} , who they have no experience on. 20 bans has been suggested so many times, dont you think they wouldve been implemented if it was a good idea?
> [{quoted}](name=Cind3rkick,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=zoIoYde4,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-11-16T18:09:26.924+0000) > > And so if a with 20 marksmen banned the adc role wont exist. > > Or how about we ban every prevalent top laner aside from our first pick so the enemy has to go {{champion:48}} , who they have no experience on. > > 20 bans has been suggested so many times, dont you think they wouldve been implemented if it was a good idea? Except this would never happen, with the exception of maybe pro play, and thats a big maybe considering what you'd leave open as a result. People made similar arguments about 10 bans before it came out. In solo queue you’re never going to be able to get 4 other strangers with individual anti champ biases to do this let alone counting on the other team to do the same. Even if you did manage to ban most of a class, there are enough off meta picks that function similarly to fill that niche. For example with marksmen, i know machine gun lulu or attack speed teemo aren’t necessary strong right now, but they would probably provide more value to a team sans adc then sticking in some random weird kill lane down there instead.
Arrowtip (EUNE)
: Why everyone says that league is a bad game and are switching to Fortnite ?
People up here using league skill as a measure of intelligence, I’m dead, that’s next level autistic
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=0001000000000000000000000000000000010000,timestamp=2018-05-10T16:44:14.262+0000) > > I never admitted to being toxic, you choose to see it that way. > > All I’m saying is that to me it seems like you were attacking him, so I defended him, the fact that you tried so hard to stick to your guns on him being silver despite your grasp on the statistics being shoddy is a heavy indication that I’m right in my interpretation of your intentions. > > Seeing as how I can not read your mind, and that you could possibly be backtracking, I can only base my reactions on what I perceive you as, sorry if that makes you feel shitty, but not really. Well, if you want to be willfully blind, that's on you. I'm out.
> [{quoted}](name=Seen,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=00010000000000000000000000000000000100000000,timestamp=2018-05-10T16:49:20.849+0000) > > Well, if you want to be willfully blind, that's on you. I'm out. Seeing things differently than you based on my own observation is not being “willfully” blind, but you do you boo boo.
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=00010000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-05-10T15:47:39.408+0000) > > I mean you’re the one who kept going on about silver silver silver and I’m willing to bet you did so in an effort to neg the OP, **so as far as I’m concerned I’m only returning the favor**. Let's see here. You blatantly said that it's ok to be toxic if someone else is toxic and in this situation you admitted you were being toxic because you THOUGHT I was.
> [{quoted}](name=Seen,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=000100000000000000000000000000000001,timestamp=2018-05-10T16:32:57.577+0000) > > Let's see here. You blatantly said that it's ok to be toxic if someone else is toxic and in this situation you admitted you were being toxic because you THOUGHT I was. I never admitted to being toxic, you choose to see it that way. All I’m saying is that to me it seems like you were attacking him, so I defended him, the fact that you tried so hard to stick to your guns on him being silver despite your grasp on the statistics being shoddy is a heavy indication that I’m right in my interpretation of your intentions. Seeing as how I can not read your mind, and that you could possibly be backtracking, I can only base my reactions on what I perceive you as, sorry if that makes you feel shitty, but not really.
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=00010000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-05-10T15:47:39.408+0000) > > I mean you’re the one who kept going on about silver silver silver and I’m willing to bet you did so in an effort to neg the OP, so as far as I’m concerned I’m only returning the favor. No. If you looked at my post in this thread, I never shamed his test results, nor did I say silver was a bad rank. All I said was if we were to convert his results, he would be upper silver. Glad to know you think being toxic is ok
> [{quoted}](name=Seen,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=000100000000000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-05-10T16:04:38.115+0000) > > No. If you looked at my post in this thread, I never shamed his test results, nor did I say silver was a bad rank. All I said was if we were to convert his results, he would be upper silver. Glad to know you think being toxic is ok I mean if I’m wrong about your intentions then that’s one thing but, i just call em as I see them and react accordingly, if you think that’s toxic then whatever, to each his own.
: Attractive women appreciation thread
http://doramakun.ru/thumbs/users/7581/Photo/K/Kyung-Soo-Jin/Starhaus-Entertainment-Concept-Photos/Kyung-Soo-Jin01-300.jpg
: > [{quoted}](name=makkii,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=000100000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-05-10T14:55:24.137+0000) > > I mean I haven’t been to school for like 7 years but I’m pretty sure 73% is a C, that aside gold consists of 23% of the player base, plat 8.3% dia 1.8%, so being gold 5 0 Lp is top 32% > > Also silver is top 65-30 but then gold shoots up to top 20 and beyond? That ten point gap, Can you even math? It's a B in Canada. https://www.classbase.com/Countries/canada/Grading-System Also, I'm giving an estimate of placement. Gold ranges anywhere from top 10% to top 33% where 20% should be the average gold player. Are you just going to be an ass and nitpick every little thing?
> [{quoted}](name=Seen,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=TeXoZERd,comment-id=0001000000000000000000000000,timestamp=2018-05-10T15:37:23.127+0000) > > It's a B in Canada. > https://www.classbase.com/Countries/canada/Grading-System > > Also, I'm giving an estimate of placement. Gold ranges anywhere from top 10% to top 33% where 20% should be the average gold player. Are you just going to be an ass and nitpick every little thing? I mean you’re the one who kept going on about silver silver silver and I’m willing to bet you did so in an effort to neg the OP, so as far as I’m concerned I’m only returning the favor.
Boreto (EUNE)
: How are koreans able to play under 10 ping?
Most people live in the outskirts of Seoul where the lol Korea servers are likely located, and use fiber lines is why
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makkii

Level 155 (NA)
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