Zahtar (EUW)
: Riot, please give Xin Zhao a horse
Eh there are better ways to make Xin Zhao than tacking a decidedly mundane animal under him JUST because he's riding a horse in one of his splash arts. Seems contrived is all... Especially considering that we have more interesting mounts already in the game with Skaarl, Valor and Willump. You want Xin to be mounted fine, but let's do something better than a horse at the least.
Tailypo (NA)
: I've been dipping into top lane a bit more lately (usually jg), and I was wondering what are some of the safest picks for that lane that are also strong picks for the team more often than not. Especially when picking first or second, what are some of the hardest to counter top lane picks? I've been going with {{champion:8}} and {{champion:50}} as two champs that I'd like to improve with, but I don't have a whole lot of experience with top lane. Learned that Swain is not so great vs Yasuo last night.
> [{quoted}](name=Tailypo,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=JFAAxGEA,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-08-21T15:48:00.687+0000) > > I've been dipping into top lane a bit more lately (usually jg), and I was wondering what are some of the safest picks for that lane that are also strong picks for the team more often than not. Especially when picking first or second, what are some of the hardest to counter top lane picks? I've been going with {{champion:8}} and {{champion:50}} as two champs that I'd like to improve with, but I don't have a whole lot of experience with top lane. Learned that Swain is not so great vs Yasuo last night. I semi OTP swain in midland and I gotta say say is actually one of my more favorable matchups for swain.
BBandit9 (NA)
: Whats the most Ionian champion?
{{champion:39}} . She even has a voice line to Garen stealing his nationalism shouts IOOOOONIIIIIAAAA
: Most likely toplaners for an Ultimate skin?
I think Jax is the no brainer here. He's a timeless classic chamion that has always maintained relevance despite his ancient kit. Plus there is a fantasy of the Grand Weapons Master to be fulfilled, but after GGMF I thinks Riot wants to. E more creative than just giving a bunch of weapons to switch unless they all have custom animations and sound.
: How are Ekko and Camille related?
At last years LoL lore panel one of the writers mentioned that some characters are further along their arcs than others. He used Ekko as an example stating "He hasn't even had his Uncle Ben moment yet" Camille tried to kill Caitlyn's parents and it's not a stretch to say that Elmo is on her list of interesting persons. His strides in time traveling have captured the attentions of many notable persons in Piltover and Zaun. Jayce and Victor both want him as an apprentice, the missing piece of unanchoring Zilean from time likely lies with Ekko and even Urgot is impressed with the boy Camilles job is to keep Zaun in Zaun and protect Piltovers interests. Ekkos' discovery is monumental in scale and it could upset the balance in power between the twin cities. Ekkos' philosophy of Zaun excellence is something that Camille would also not appreciate from the gutter snipe, she would hope he would stay in his rightful place. I believe the related champions in Universe doesn't just pertain to characters that HAVE already interacted, but also to characters that will eventually interact. Camille is just the character to send Ekko down a darker side of his arc if this Uncle Ben comment is to be taken at face value
Manxxom (NA)
: So what is the demon that Swain is "wielding"
I'd Ike to point out that Swain didn't enter a pact with Beatrice and they do not have a mutually beneficial relationship. He either tricked or forced the demon to be an instrument of his will. Small detail that makes him more badass than you think.
Sukishoo (NA)
: Should they just make all fire themes into one then? Wu has Volcanic, Warwick has Firefang , Zyra has wildfire, Ahri has foxfire, Malph has Obsidian, Sol has Ashen lord, Kindred had shadowfire, and Ren and Xerath have scorched Earth. XD
> [{quoted}](name=Sukishoo,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=a18kcYRH,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-08-14T12:08:44.026+0000) > > Should they just make all fire themes into one then? > > Wu has Volcanic, Warwick has Firefang , Zyra has wildfire, Ahri has foxfire, Malph has Obsidian, Sol has Ashen lord, Kindred had shadowfire, and Ren and Xerath have scorched Earth. > > XD Most of those are just part of the infernal theme funnily enough.
: Garen's make-ups are too thick...
> There is nothing wrong to for a man to love another man in the biblical way. Lol wat
: Please don't further exaggerating Garen&Katarina, they are not supposed to be romantic at all.
Febos (EUW)
: > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > First these are currently the Aspects we know from: > {{champion:131}} Diana the Aspect of the Moon > {{champion:89}} Leona the Aspect of the Sun > {{champion:10}} Kayle the Aspect of Justice > {{champion:25}} Morgana the Aspect of Humanity > {{champion:44}} Taric the Aspect of the Protector > {{champion:142}} Zoe the Aspect of Twilight > {{champion:80}} Pantheon the Aspect of War As far as we know, there's no such thing as the "Aspect of Humanity". First, let me clarify something. None of those are the actual Aspects. The Aspect is the celestial entity. Leona, Diana, Taric, etc are the **hosts** for their respective Aspects. For all intents and purposes host and Aspect are different entities. Kayle and Morgana mother was the host to the Aspect of Justice. She was with child **before** she became one with the Aspect of Justice. Both Kayle and Morgana have remnants of that Aspect in them. We don't know for sure if Kayle became the new host, but we know Morgana didn't. What we know from their lore is that Kayle ascended Mount Targon to be with their mother, many years ago. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > We know from the lore that if you climb Mount Targon you have a chance to get chosen by a celestial being and made into a Aspect. Now before you climb the Mountain you are a human and when you ascent you ARE the aspect until you die. Like I said above, host and Aspect are different things, but we can say they are "fused" together. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > Additionally are the aspects here to protect Runeterra or to protect the whole universe? We know that these celestial aspects created the first ascended but why? We have answers for all of that in the lore, kinda. We know from [Soraka's lore](https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/story/champion/soraka/) that Celestials have a destiny planned for the creatures in the mortal realm. We don't know if Runeterra is the only place with such creatures, because Celestials exist all across Aurelion's creation. Regardless, Aspects aren't there to protect Runeterra, per say. A new host is chosen whenever there's conflict. They are chosen to resolve that conflict and get back to the "right track". As far as we know, the Shurima Ascended where created for the same purpose, albeit being "inferior" beings to those chosen as host for an Aspect. As I said above, an Aspect's host is fused with the entity itself, while an Ascended, like Nasus or Renekton, are fused with celestial energy. In [Twilight of the Gods](https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/story/twilight-of-the-gods/), the Aspect of Twilight, Myisha, aka Zoe, says the following: > "Some of you turned out not so bad, I suppose, but most of you were so damaged in the war with the Void, it’s a wonder you survived this long. Perhaps you and your kind were a mistake to begin with, but a mistake I can help correct.” Also, it looks like the Aspect of the Sun may be the one being such power: > “What the sun made, the moon will unmake!” screamed Ta’anari. It was Myisha who taught Ta’anari how to use the spell to unmake the Darkin. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > So does that mean Aspects can get pregnant? Can they have children? As I said in the beginning, Mihira was already pregnant when she climbed Mount Targon with Kilam. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > Zoe got didn't had to climb Mount Targon to get ascended There are no rules about that. The Aspect chooses the host. Also, it doesn't matter if you climb Mount Targon or not, because you might not be chosen. They make the rules. They are the ones who make the decision to fuse with a mortal. Because of that reason, they can do whatever they want. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > Well in the story this "Myisha" is acting very VERY diffrently compared to Zoe. And why should she change her name? Myisha and Zoe are the same. Let's not forget that the Aspect of Twilight is also known as the Aspect of Change, as mentioned by Aatrox in his quotes. That Aspect likes to plays tricks on people, so it isn't that farfetched that she would change her name. For all you know, she may have called herself Myisha only for the Darkin reunion. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > The Aspect of War said that Atreus was not strong enough to become ascended but still took over his body and used it for it's own sake. The Aspects can suppress the mortal mind/soul, much like the Darkin can suppress their hosts mind/soul. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > So does that mean the celestial being itself just took Atreus body? > Is that also the case for the others? > Does that mean Diana isn't actually the girls real name but the name of the celestial aspect? No. Diana and Leona are real **mortal** people, much like every other host. As I said for Zoe's case, the Aspects can do whatever the hell they want. They have god-like powers. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > Why did it took over a human body that it said was "unworthy" of ascension? It all doesn't make sense. It does make sense. You just don't understand the story. The Aspect of War judged Atreus unworthy to be in control of the its power. Likely Pantheon chose that body in particular because Atreus managed to survive the climb and only strong warriors can. However, in Pantheon's eyes, Atreus was strong enough to be a host but not strong enough to control its powers. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > Now the most confusing part: In his new bio we know that Pantheon who is controlling Atreus DIES in a fight with Aatrox. Honestly this part just made my head explode. Does that mean the celestial aspects can die? It surely looks like they can die. This is nothing new though. We've known Aspects can die as far back as [Aurelion's story](https://universe.leagueoflegends.com/en_US/story/aurelionsol-color-story/): > I sense Pantheon’s celestial kin, scattered across the cosmos. In a single instance, all of their attention is focused on this world, where one of their earthly Aspects was vaporized by their own weapon. Now we know what this "weapon" is. It was a Darkin and it killed an Aspect. *** > [{quoted}](name=NeverGame,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=sbEEptFe,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-08-01T19:56:46.007+0000) > > Anyway Atreus survived this whole thing and now is back in control of his own body and hates all Darkin and Aspects. > Now this is what this is all about who does Atreus hate? Zoe or the celestial aspect behind Zoe? Pantheon hates false gods. The Aspect and the host are fused together. They're the same, but different. Try not to think to much about it. Pantheon hates the Aspect that controls Zoe's body (host), but Zoe represents the Aspect itself, so he probably hates her too. Same goes for the other Aspects and their hosts.
>It surely looks like they can die. This is nothing new though. We've known Aspects can die as far back as Aurelion's story: >I sense Pantheon’s celestial kin, scattered across the cosmos. In a single instance, all of their attention is focused on this world, where one of their earthly Aspects was vaporized by their own weapon. By earthly Aspect it meant that the host body was vaporized by Aurelion Sol. Pantheon itself lived. Aatroxs' blade did the exact opposite, destroying the celestial Aspect, Pantheon, but leaving it's earthly host Atreus alive.
: I love it JUST MAKE IT A THING RIOT STOP THIS TEASING
Them committing resources to make that cinematic for them almost means Katarina and Garen is certainly still a thing and they will meet soon (or have already met and we'll get a flashback style vignette). It's probably gonna happen in a story though. I just want them to develop more on their own before it happens though.
: I also looked forward to learning more about the Aspects. A lot of the hate for the old lore was unwarranted imo, and nothing more that disgruntled fans pinning their hate on the Aspect. The new lore corrects the main problem of the old lore immediately however, it explains that Pantheon possessing Atreus was done malevolently and his purpose for doing so. While I dislike that the new lore partially justifies some fans' unreasonable hate, it really is the version of the lore we ought to have received from day 1. I love Targon as a region and the extended Shuriman continent and look forward to Atreus' story from here. I hope we get some updates to the stories of other Targon champs, even if only minor changes.
Leona and Diana are 100% gonna get their bios chopped in half. They're way outside of the standard word count for bios and are borderline stories at this point. I hope that we actually do get some continuation of on the ground Targon though as it's been quite some time since Riot checked in. Maybe Leona and Diana can finally meet up... or at least Nami and Diana
GreenLore (EUW)
: Why is everyone acting like Pantheon and Leona had this super deep bond all of a sudden? The 2 were childhood friends, but its appearant from their lores that their bond isn't very strong or deep(in the new lore Atreus was the one who should execute Leona and in the old one, Leona opposed the views of the rakkor, which pantheon followed without question).
> [{quoted}](name=GreenLore,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=HE3KoO1Y,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-07-31T12:59:22.470+0000) > > Why is everyone acting like Pantheon and Leona had this super deep bond all of a sudden? > The 2 were childhood friends, but its appearant from their lores that their bond isn't very strong or deep(in the new lore Atreus was the one who should execute Leona and in the old one, Leona opposed the views of the rakkor, which pantheon followed without question). Pre-Universe overhaul when Targon was still called Mount Gargantuan people shipped them for the same reason that they shipped Ezreal and Lux I guess. Blonde hair? Just the shared Greek aesthetic was enough I guess, but ever since Asol came out Leona and Atreus have been bitter rivals on the best of days so I don't really get it either.
: Pantheon narrative and story questions
I think it's a good thing for the following reason: A.) Moves the story forward, which has been a huge sticking point for League lore. Now we know the Celestial Aspects can be killed (massive implications) and Aatrox got a little update with us knowing his current status is probably hostless. There are also implications regarding Aurelion Sol... is the killing of Pantheon the factor that leads to him regaining control of his body and coming to Runeterra? B.) Moves the character forward, if Pantheon remained Pantheon than we are stuck with a unfeeling god whose motivations have not changed and probably won't. The best thing this character can accomplish is to "feel epic" in a sense of development. With Atreus we have someone who was born under a religious system that brainwashed him, becomes disillusioned by that system after seeing how it used him and now empowering himself as a mortal man to try to take back control. A much more dynamic character arc and that's to be expected Atreus was the real character this whole time. C.) Obfuscates the celestial plot, Riot simply cannot let us play as a modern Pantheon with 100 voicelines and effectively givie away the entire set-up behind Mount Targon. The region works on mystery, we're supposed to see the factors at play that lead to all the religious fanaticism but knowing more will demystify entirely and make it feel flat. Conversely, having us play as Pantheon and not have spill his guts on the nature of celestial aspects and the greater picture going on in Upstairs Targon is a cheap way of obfuscating the plot. The character would have to play dumb and that would only be frustrating to players. This is why Leona and Diana only have fragments of their Aspects memories, why Kayle and Morgana are only descendants of a true Aspect wielding her power, why Taric has been granted autonomy by his Aspect to protect what he deems important and why Zoe is an unreliable narrator. To obscure thew meta story within Targon
: A Small Nit Pick At Pantheon's New Attack Animations
More satisfying and less static animation. Every animation is League is overly done and have explosive keyframes (where the champ moves every bit of their anatomy) to sell a move. It's not going for accuracy or practicality, but spectacle like watching UFC vs the WWE
: Piltover already has ADCs with Caitlyn and Ezreal. What this region is really lacking is a main support. **Current Pilties** Top {{champion:126}} {{champion:164}} Jungle {{champion:254}} Mid {{champion:61}} {{champion:74}} Bot {{champion:51}} {{champion:81}} Supp _404 Support not found_
> [{quoted}](name=Chembaron Yamada,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=00kFY5n6,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2019-07-31T12:55:51.118+0000) > > Piltover already has ADCs with Caitlyn and Ezreal. What this region is really lacking is a main support. > > **Current Pilties** > Top {{champion:126}} {{champion:164}} > Jungle {{champion:254}} > Mid {{champion:61}} {{champion:74}} > Bot {{champion:51}} {{champion:81}} > Supp _404 Support not found_ Braum was supposed to be Piltovers first support back when he was just "CeeCee" https://lolstatic-a.akamaihd.net/frontpage/apps/prod/artbook/en_US/f31d8b829b603b4b65fdff2475bd0803ced0179d/assets/content/champion/14_braum/braum_03.jpg
: What is up with Pantheons new dance?!?!?
It could be intentional. A sort of joke based on the first "video stills" from back in the old west back when you could watch a movie at 1 fps.
: Shouldn't Pantheon be severed in half? Like look at the gigantic size of Aatrox and his fucking Sword. Now mix that together with the strenght of an Ascendend/Darkin and ye...how does one only get such a small cut? I have bigger cuts than that, Pantheon should have been sliced in half. Also, Aatrox could easily reforge his Arm out of the people around him, hell he already forged his entire body himself.
> [{quoted}](name=SuicidePlank,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=mOTwBOQO,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-07-31T14:57:32.181+0000) > > Shouldn't Pantheon be severed in half? Like look at the gigantic size of Aatrox and his fucking Sword. > Now mix that together with the strenght of an Ascendend/Darkin and ye...how does one only get such a small cut? > I have bigger cuts than that, Pantheon should have been sliced in half. > > Also, Aatrox could easily reforge his Arm out of the people around him, hell he already forged his entire body himself. There is a big slice in Pantheons shield that looks consistent in angle with the scar on his chest. I'm guessing the intention of the artist is to suggest Pantheon blocked most of the blow
Žvirblis1 (EUNE)
: Pantheon concept art?
They will prolly come out on ArtStation soon enough like Morde, Qiyana and Yuumis did last month.
: I don't think Targons are as god-like as that. They are god-like, no doubt, but they clearly have their limits. The closest thing we have to a true "god" in Runeterra (that we know of) is probably Nagakabouros. Targons are some kind of Celestial empire that we know are powerful and galaxy-spanning, but we don't know much more beyond that. This isn't like capturing death in Greek myth and no one dying for a while.
From the Aatrox AMA https://docs.google.com/document/d/1y4P50HaDkAz7JdOMTD8c_ySYI6IuzIWasE9ApfL_5AE/edit > WAAAARGHbobo on if Nagakaborous can kill Aatrox “I think it's possible Illaoi's god could free/kill Aatrox's human soul and allow that soul to return to the cosmos. But it's complicated because the celestial concept Aatrox merged with and gained his ascended power from -- has been trapped/deleted. Literally the ideal/idea he represented ceased to exist when he was trapped. Human's no longer could even have the thought/idea he was the avatar of.” >WAAAARGhbobo on Aatrox’s history as an Ascended “He was a very powerful Ascended-- i.e. a human imbued/transformed by a Celestial power. (Aspects are related to Ascended-- i.e. Are you going to the source of the Celestial power or are pulling some of that power down to you.) If Ascended beings wrest the power from celestial concepts I.E an Aspect and effectively kill it when they do, then it does follow that when Aatrox stabbed Pantheon with his sword and scored Pantheon from the stars that the celestial concept Pantheon represents, War, ceased to exist in that moment. I know the details pertain to Darkin in this scenario. But when Aatrox, Varus and Rhaast were imprisoned those celestial concepts that they represented and were known to humanity died too. It's not a massive leap to also think that when Aatrox used the celestial power in his sword to literally make the star that represented War go supernova that destroyed War as much as making Panth into a Darkin (if such a thing is even possible) could have.
: The crucial thing is, the aspects of Sunlight, Moonlight, protector, twilight aren't _assholes_ like the aspect of war. The last time he appeared in the lore was when A-sol blasted him into oblivion with a newly formed planet core because of the sheer assholeness of the aspect of war. I'm glad he is literally gone and he deserved it.
> [{quoted}](name=Crimson Zeppelin,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=UmHJAlQH,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-07-30T01:20:59.356+0000) > > The crucial thing is, the aspects of Sunlight, Moonlight, protector, twilight aren't _assholes_ like the aspect of war. > > The last time he appeared in the lore was when A-sol blasted him into oblivion with a newly formed planet core because of the sheer assholeness of the aspect of war. I'm glad he is literally gone and he deserved it. They're all kind of assholes. They don't care about humanity at all, all they care about is destroying the Void at any costs. Sun and Moon allow fanatical followers to destroy one another. War put Aurelion Sol on a leash and used him for eons. Twilight is especially an asshole. Protector hasn't done anything dubious yet, but who knows what it's true mission is because it allows Taric the autonomy to protect what HE thinks is precious, but maybe not the Aspect.
Naalith (NA)
: Alright, so I really like Pantheon's new lore but I feel like we really need clarification on Targon
Holy shit this was long as fuck. My bad. 1.) It seems that their primary objective is to destroy the Void. The problem is they do so from the position of uncaring godlike entities and a lot of their efforts cause a lot of collateral damage to Runeterra and they are willing to use drastic measures. The Darkin are one such measure, so is the enslavement of Aurelion Sol, and perhaps they are even responsible for the Rune War if these are the same transdimensional beings that created the Runes that were later used to create our reality. Without them though, The Void would have probably swallowed the whole planet after Icathia so the Aspects for now may be a necessary evil. Also worth noting that the Targonian Aspects and the other Celestial beings are not one and the same, so Soraka doesn't speak for Targon. She may be closer in affiliation with Bard and Aurelion Sol than with someone like Pantheon. In short, me thinks they want to kill the Void and the Watchers simply because they are diametrically opposed in every way, but this is a war so vast it must be fought on all fronts. Including Runeterra, maybe a war that can ONLY be fought in Runeterra as it exists in the middle of both realms. 2.) For the sake of maintaining some of the mystery behind the Aspects themselves Riot won't allow us to interact directly with them. That's why Leona and Diana experience only fragmented memories when they merged with their Aspects. To obscure the framework of the Targon story. It's why Taric is largely autonomous, probably the only Aspect acting of his own free will and maintaining his personality. Kayle and Morgana aren't true Aspects, but descended from Mihila and imbued with her powers. Zoe is a wildcard and an unreliable narrator so we can't trust what she says. And now Pantheon is dead and Atreus has returned. Why? Out of necessity, I predicted this would happen because putting Pantheon in the game would ruin Targons' overarching story by destroying the mystery. We know a bit more about the Aspects with Aatrox, Kayle and Morgana and through Reddit AMAs so Riot is slowly peeling back the layers of mystery, but they won't be ready to deep dive on what's going on in the Celestial Realm for some time. Probably not until Kayle comes back and has to tell the reader/viewer what's going on up there, because at that point Riot can't get away with obfuscating the truth with unreliable narrators, convenient memory loss, absentee characters or in this more recent case: literal Deicide. 3.) I'd assume for the same reason that the Watchers cannot come to Runeterra and had to create the Voidborn to further their agenda for them. Because they simply can't... The barriers between the realms do not work that way. Based on my theory that there are four realms of reality in the lore Physical/Spiritual/Celestial/The Void. I'd argue that the Spirit Realms and Physical are the closest to one another as in the barrier is the thinnest. People like Shen, Yordles and Mordekaiser can regularly traverse both realms and both realms have a constant recognizable effect on the other. The Celestial Realm and the Void are much different beasts. The Celestial may as well just be conceptual thought given endless form. It's probably a very abstract place like a stereotypical quantum mathematics realm that is represented in media by a giant white space with complex equations floating around. Something you aren't even capable of fathoming. Much like to us the Void must feel like closing our eyes if you wanted a simple explanation, but in reality humans cannot experience true nothingness. Not just blackness, but the absence of heat, no sense of time, so much nothing that you don't even know you're experiencing nothing. It's the reason all humans fear death and why every culture since the dawn of time has tried to explain what will happen after life. Like you said Soraka had to forfeit her immortality, create a vessel to inhabit that is wracked with constant pain; all to make a small difference in peoples lives because she is so benevolent. This is so outside of the Aspects M.O, they aren't willing to sacrifice so much for us because we are ants to them. Completely inconsequential, besides as hosts for them to do battle with their mortal enemy, the Void. Runeterra is just a place between two points where the Celestials and Void Realms converge, so this is will have to be their battleground. 4.) Without a sense of timeline its hard to say. But perhaps the event that Aurelion references as him gaining some of his freedom at the end of his bio >Then, he felt it–a weakening in his unwilling pact. The voices from the crown grew sporadic, clashing, arguing with each other while some fell ominously silent. An unknown catastrophe he could not fathom had thrown off the balance of those who bound him. Could this be the Aspect of Wars death? The problem with the region is it actually depends on mystery to work, it's most closely related to the overarching conflict in League of Legends that will eventually have to come to a head, the conflict between celestials and The Void. Once the curtain is lifted on this everything else will become very trite and small by comparison. Who cares about class-related conflict in Piltover and Zaun when reality as we know it is being threatened by Lovecraftian monstrosities and uncaring space gods? All Riot can do is tease it and give us hints. This is why I'm actually hoping for some more mundane Targon lore. Rakkor, Solari, Lunari conflicts, Religious fanaticism with that spicy Warhammer 40k flavor, the cruelty inflicted by people that misinterpret the will of Aspects. Maybe just close the Nami or Leona searching for Diana story arc and set up the next part which will get closer to the more celestial aspects of the lore. Who knows?
Kiryu (NA)
: Next Champion Roadmap?
To go all of September to 2020 with only one new champ and zero VGU seems a little sparse if you ask me.
Terozu (NA)
: I'm really interested in how Atreus compares to Zoe.
My interpretation is that, when Pantheon died the whole concept of warfare briefly went away with him in the conscious minds of mortals. So technically Atreus robbed all of mortals of a peaceful utopia when he went after Aatrox again and renewed the celestial concept of war. Nice going buddy...
: Does anybody remember the ascension ritual?
All the priests who administered Ascension are dead, but its' doubtful that they had anything to do with the aactual Ascension in the first place. Renekton became Ascended despite "not being worthy" and believing he would die carrying Nasus up the steps, Xerath was clearly not worthy and got MEGA ASCENDED before Nasus and Renek slapped the coffin on him he was clearly in a League of his own among Ascended. Azir ascended way after the priests got C L A P P E D. All the future Darkin were recommended for Ascension by them, but they obviously shouldn't have been "worthy" based on their following actions The priests were full of shit and their rituals probably were just malarkey that they used to justify their existence and paychecks.
iSpartan (NA)
: I have no problems with them updating the look and the animations, it is the abilities that I love most of all. These guys have a tendency to make characters less fun to play after a rework like this. Malzahar, Gallio, Warwick even Ashe, (and many more, I'm sure) all used to play much more fun than their current versions. They are going to take away the fun of Panth. Those champions were originally made the way they were made for good reasons. These new staffers just see old and believe old = bad. That is not the case. Pantheon as he is, is a true asset to any team and it will be a real SHAME to lose that. I am sure the rework will prove to be an asset as well but that is not the point, the old will be gone and that is a tragedy. Just yesterday I was playing Panth and thinking how much I love the champion. Today I log in to see this rework news and I can't help but feel sad, even betrayed. They could bring out the new but keep the old as a legacy build. The new should be free for anyone that owns Pantheon. The old should be unavailable for purchase but still available to play for those that own and love him the way he was meant to be. They should do that with every rework.
I dispute that the champions were made the way they were for any other reason than Riot was cranking out champs every two weeks to stay on top of the MOBA game when the game was peaking in 2010-2011. That a lot of them were not good concepts to begin with and if you look not at full-scale VGUs but just heavy reworks than you will see this group of champions have had the most changes to them. I do agree that staying close to the spirit of the old champion is key, but I'm not worried because that's what Riot seems to be doing here. Like Ezreal and Nunu this seems to be shaping up to be one of those net positive VGU. As a former Swain (I liked the change tho) and Aatrox (not so much) player I can tell you it's not nearly as bad as you're making it out to be. Pantheon has retained every ability and seems to be just gaining in skill expressiveness especially on the Q and R, you can move during the E now and from what I can see the W stun is identical. It just looks to be an improvement. He is hopefully losing that terrible passive though and if anyone Pantheon mains are salty about that I have no qualms about completely disregarding their opinion. Anyone who wants to preserve that abomination of a mechanic clearly isn't thinking about the bigger picture and health of the game.
: It's his THEME. Not his login. It was honestly a really cool way of showing his new art. I liked it. I'm sure he'll get an animated login later.
> [{quoted}](name=C0NCH0BAR,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=WGzO6lAz,comment-id=00050000,timestamp=2019-07-29T17:05:28.933+0000) > > It's his THEME. Not his login. It was honestly a really cool way of showing his new art. I liked it. I'm sure he'll get an animated login later. I think based on Yuumi, Morde and Qiyana its' safe to say we're not getting anymore animated logins Just found this explanation in the Client update >Will the login screen look any different? >Because you'll skip the login screen once you've stored your credentials and get into game quicker, we're going to have them include static images without background music. Most of the time, double clicking the League of Legends shortcut will send you straight to game, so we didn’t want to have flashy or resource-intensive things you’ll barely ever see. This change also frees up the art and music teams to put more time into other exciting projects.
: Ah. I see that now. Thanks for the correction. Also, am I correct in my assumption that Full Metal is now Hextech, or is it still "Full Metal Pantheon" and it just looks like "Hextech Pantheon"? Also, hello. I don't believe I've seen you here before. Unless you're a Rioter I've met previously and you've changed you name.
Nah it belongs in the same universe that Nunubot exists. The background is exactly the same. Hextech shape language is more distinct and decidedly "League of Legends" while this is a bit more generic
: Will Leona get a VGU since Panth got it?
> [{quoted}](name=JhonTeemon,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ArEJBzsm,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-07-29T16:59:56.771+0000) > > Will Leona get a VGU since Panth got it? She'll get a VU prolly alongside a Diana VGU one day like K&M did
: Calling Out The Aspects
Totally called it btw =P
Naalith (NA)
: Oh, so it has. I'm a little surprised they didn't acknowledge Atreus's relationship with Aurelion Sol now. Are the other Targonians still just controlling him even though that was Pantheon's job before? Is Aurelion free? Do Atreus and Aurelion have am amicable relationship because they both have beef with the Aspects? I'm guessing Atreus knows of the Void and wants it destroyed as well, and Aurelion fears the Watchers, so it should be good. Wish they had clarified it.
What if the events of the Pantheon bio are the events that set Aurelion free to begin with. Conflict between the Targonian Aspects, voices no longer unified as one, bickering amongst the stars.
: "Pantheon", as entity, not champion, seems dead. However the concept of War still very much exists in Runeterra, so there must be some of it left in Atreus ("Pantheon" as a champion). I know a few Aatrox mains freaking out because of that. Rightfully so.
> [{quoted}](name=LordRedStone Nr1,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=ItEysMYN,comment-id=00030000,timestamp=2019-07-29T16:18:05.746+0000) > > "Pantheon", as entity, not champion, seems dead. However the concept of War still very much exists in Runeterra, so there must be some of it left in Atreus ("Pantheon" as a champion). > I know a few Aatrox mains freaking out because of that. Rightfully so. After Atreus beats Aatrox the Pantheon star blazes back to life. Seems to indicate that "War" isn't gone, but that Atreus may have changed it in some way.
: Just my own hot take here: I'd say Volibear feels comparable to Fenrir. A deity who was treated more like a beast by his fellow godkin (and with Lissandra banishing him and the Ursine), which amounted to him actually becoming the monster everyone thought he was. Id say he's like Thor only in the most superficial overlap as both conjure thunder and lightning. But narratively speaking Volibear feels like he has more in common with the myth of Fenrir. Edit: I know the devs are still debating their approach to Volibear's rework. I know some fans are hoping for Voli to maintain his "nobility". My fingers are crossed for less of that. I like the idea and it feels far more appropriate that the Freljord worship a bear-god of the 'wilderness' and a being who opposes civilization in its entirety. Makes his and Ornn's duality that much more poetic.
The tidbits we got in the Fiddlesticks/Volibear update post are building towards a Lissandra/Volibear rivalry more than they are with Ornn or anyone else. Think about it, first Volibear blinds Liss... then she banishes him and the Ursine (btw wheres' the source for this? Ashe comics or Lissandra bio? I'll assume its' true because it fits the narrative I'm trying to spin though lol.) After that Lissandra begins spreading her religion, the Cult of The Three. In the update article, Jellbug has this to say about the current Volibear story direction > he destroys human creations and their falsehoods and does get involved in their wars, and he certainly does not care to be ignored. Perhaps he resents the fact that humans have become less dependent on their demigods, to the extent that they have forgotten their roots. Perhaps he wants us all to return to the old ways of lost myth and unsung ritual. This could mean Volibear has a particular bone to pick with Lissandra for trying to reform the Freljord and move on from "the old ways". NOT TO MENTION. The Russian twitter tease with an image of Volibear followed by that leak about a Lissandra story in the works. I'd say it's all lining up
Falrein (EUW)
: Who's more powerful - Ryze or Syndra?
Ryze is the closest thing League has to a main character Syndra is pretty much a villain despite her background It doesnt' really matter whose stronger, bullshit rules of story telling dictate that Ryze in some roundabout way will beat her. (Syndra stronger tho)
: Varus the Darkin is taking revenge against everything, he became a monster (Darkin) and also lost all his family and was imprisoned in a bow. He hunts the guilty. Kalista hunts people who betray, double cross, and/or otherwise bamboozle people, taking the betrayed persons soul in as a promise that their betrayer will be brought down. Varus is doing what he does out of self interest, and Kalista does it because she was betrayed and as a spirit thats the only thing that can temporaily call her from the shadows, is to take and carry out an oath.
Thought I should add that The Black Mist has an additional effect on lesser spirits that robs them of their autonomy if they do not have the willpower to resist like Ledros did. Kinda like having Alzheimers and using one memory as an anchor to keep you from losing all of your marbles. All of the greater undead spirits singlemindedly chase one thing significant to them in life to keep the Mist at bay. Kalista: Need to punish betrayers Thresh: The joy he gets from torturing Hecarim: Bloodshed, cruelty, warfare Karthus: Religious appreciation of death Even non-Shadow Islanders show symptoms. Mordekaiser: While not a Black Mist undead soul, he resisted true death via force of will in much the same way. Through his anger at his faith being false. Pyke: His hold on his own autonomy is much less tenuous than the others, he might be almost completely under the influence of the Jaulfish and only be using his illogical methodology of punishing his so called betrayers and his "list" might just be an extension of the Jaulfish controlling him without him knowing. A lot like the mental conditioning used in Black Ops 1 to make the main character act against his own will without him even knowing he is being controlled.
: Wait a minute..
Varus should prolly be the Darkin Bow if we want to be more accurate, not like the guy has a quiver on his back and even if he did, arrows are more like ammunition than a weapon /endnitpick
l MrD l (NA)
: Wanted to give my opinion :)
I really like both approaches. The traditional Freljord God and the Demonic Dark God. In a perfect world though we would get a more fearsome demonic Volibear with Volibear A majestic mane and Es' feral dark look, with the weapons sprouting from his back and badass lightning scar oooof.
: More nervous than excited. Most of the reworks lately have been ridiculously OP, and then Riot spends the next few years nerfing and buffing them in every patch. The cycle is tedious.
> [{quoted}](name=SammyDayspring,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=mFWa8Hmw,comment-id=0002,timestamp=2019-07-25T22:16:22.279+0000) > > More nervous than excited. Most of the reworks lately have been ridiculously OP, and then Riot spends the next few years nerfing and buffing them in every patch. The cycle is tedious. They are going to give designers less free rein and actually test the new champs more aggressively before they launch. That's what they promised anyways we'll see if they can follow up...
: Discussion: Void Lore Concerns
If the Void is inspired by Lovecraft and Geiger than I'd say their current motivations are perfect. The machinations of Lovecraft especially are so terrifying because their motivations are unknowable - a gap in understanding between humanity and the occult leaves out any possibility for compromise. The Watchers have only known silence and our existence is unacceptable to them the Voidborn are instruments of their will further removing us one step from them. It's actually perfect the way it is imo. Having the Voidborn be autonomous or sentient and question their existence or their masters moves the whole thing towards a "woe is me" scenario that I really don't care to see explored
: @Riot, How many Ionians can speak to outsiders?
For storytelling purposes they probably all speak "Galactic Basic" In other words it's like the TV show Vikings, a show where Scandinavians, Englishmen and Frankians have to converse with one another despite language barriers in every other scene. They all speak in English for the viewers convenience, but at times the show shows whats' going on from one parties point of view whether it be the Vikings roaring in their brutish mother tongue during a battle at the demoralized Europeans or having the English nobility speak in old Latin while the Vikingstry and fail to circumnavigate all the little subtleties of their culture like eating dinner with utensils like a civilized human being. Otherwise they totally understand each other at all times and why? Because language barriers are frustrating and boring tediums in real life why do we have to simulate them in our fiction? 99% of the time it just gets in the way I'd prefer if Riot continued to ignore it except to add flavor every once in the while I.E shove in one asian sounding word to every other Ionian sentence.
Jaspers (EUW)
: "The vastaya’s origins can be traced back to a hidden corner of Ionia where a group of humans fled in escape of the Great Void War." From the Universe page on Vastayans. Still exists and unexplored. So Vastayans are all of a few thousand years old? How do you know that conflict doesn't exist? Targon knows of the Void, knows it's threat, enough to summon Sol from across the stars to seal rifts, enough to give civilisation like the Marai ways to protect from it. The Marai a bunch of Vastayans who live nowhere near Ionia. Then in Varus lore it's stated that the "Golden Warrior Queen with human and Vastayan moon-stalkers" defeated him, Vastayan who were all of what? A thousand years old? Timeline is off. The Great Void War is the one between Targon and Void, long before any other event on Runeterra besides Lissandra stuff. The fight over Icathia isn't really that big if you consider there are huge and old civilisations which thrived and grew during it's conflict (Shurima and Ixtal), why would anyone flee from it, so far that it's basically the opposite side of the know land mass?
> [{quoted}](name=Jaspers,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=G5uP1clg,comment-id=000000000001000000000000,timestamp=2019-07-22T10:33:54.118+0000) > > "The vastaya’s origins can be traced back to a hidden corner of Ionia where a group of humans fled in escape of the Great Void War." > > From the Universe page on Vastayans. Still exists and unexplored. So Vastayans are all of a few thousand years old? How do you know that conflict doesn't exist? Targon knows of the Void, knows it's threat, enough to summon Sol from across the stars to seal rifts, enough to give civilisation like the Marai ways to protect from it. The Marai a bunch of Vastayans who live nowhere near Ionia. > > Then in Varus lore it's stated that the "Golden Warrior Queen with human and Vastayan moon-stalkers" defeated him, Vastayan who were all of what? A thousand years old? > > Timeline is off. > > The Great Void War is the one between Targon and Void, long before any other event on Runeterra besides Lissandra stuff. The fight over Icathia isn't really that big if you consider there are huge and old civilisations which thrived and grew during it's conflict (Shurima and Ixtal), why would anyone flee from it, so far that it's basically the opposite side of the know land mass? Great Void War is now non-canon. Scathlocke tweeted that out months ago.
Adder (OCE)
: Some speculation on Jax lore
Don't forget {{champion:114}} They do fight in his color story and someone of her talent is somebody he would want to join his cause. I've also explored Jax as a nomadic drifter, a common thing with the nationalist is that most of them have no frame of reference to explain the powerful love they have of their country. They've usually never lived anywhere else so they can't empathize with other people or put themselves in their shoes / see the worth in another way of life. Having Jax see other regions got through struggles, both the good and the bad might make him stop looking back so fondly on Icathia and become more of a "citizen of the world". He could see all of the little cycles of the world repeating endlessly throughout the years and it could make him realize how small and petty Icathia really was. Noxus reflects the Ancient Shuriman Empire in this respect and Ionia is sort of like Icathia in this context. There's no need to identify so strongly with your flag because that's just how the world works see: big fish, eat little fish ... not the more ego-involved "Shurima is pure evil and MY Icathia was a bastion of independence and freedom" shallow-ass PoV he would have had as a soldier. Not saying imperialism is right or wrong, I'm saying Jax would be able to detach more easily is all. From this point in his character development he could focus on destroying the Void to cleanse the memory of Icathia, not really interested after thousands of years in bringing it back. After all it won't matter who is on top when the eldritch nothingness consumes us all. The lore seems to be taking a page from Game of Thrones books in this respect. Setting up all these pettier conflicts which encourages the key players in the world to ignore a more pressing threat in the background. So if the Void = White Walkers does Jax = John Snow?
SEKAI (OCE)
: > [{quoted}](name=Warlord Dienekes,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=n9h9I9UH,comment-id=00010001,timestamp=2019-07-19T03:33:48.911+0000) > > If they keep the whole Pantheon is a space parasite that takes over people as meat suits thing, then I think it would be important to see the face of his suit. > > Reminds you what a fucking horrible thing Pantheon is doing. I guess that's 1 way to look at it, reading Pantheon like a classic body snatcher horror. I mean, that's kinda the premise of Aspects in the first place. But I was thinking that Pantheon's face would be arbitrarily obscured because of the irrelevance of the body and their former identity in relation to the current guy in the driving seat; so that people wouldn't be looking at it and say "Pantheon's face" because that's NOT his face, nor does he himself see it that way given he sees the bodies as nothing but temporary hosts to pilot. As such, the face of the original holder can also get a burial of sort for them in a poetic sense. EDIT: After all, body snatchers usually at least act out the previous hosts' lives to some extent after snatching their bodies, given body snatcher's themes are often rooted in deception. Meanwhile Pantheons takes it over and just off to do his own thing, since he didn't do it for deception, but only because he needed a good pair of limbs. So I think it's still slightly different in the thematic to the body snatcher in a sense but hey.
It parallels with The Void and The Darkin. Evil defeated by using evil in the name of the Greater Good. Begs the question, is anything sacred and at what cost will we attain victory.
: Morde is still due for a "New" Skin
If they keep nerfing him into obscurity and sabotaging any chance he has to be a more popular pick that he will continue to be a niche pick and receive the according amount of skins. Still salty about how bad they hit him this patch when he isn't that strong to begin with. Before Mordekaiser was just a goofy champ gameplay and aesthetic wise. Now Riot is killing him before he gets off the ground.
: I saw this on S@20 (who I believe got it from reddit) for context on his face: https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/93a4af66581b5a65129b85ab4aa22f4519a711839cf89ea8b0997556ae322446.jpg?w=800&h=367
> [{quoted}](name=AbiwonKenabi,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=JEt2EE0y,comment-id=0006,timestamp=2019-07-18T22:46:55.207+0000) > > I saw this on S@20 (who I believe got it from reddit) for context on his face: > > https://uploads.disquscdn.com/images/93a4af66581b5a65129b85ab4aa22f4519a711839cf89ea8b0997556ae322446.jpg?w=800&h=367 >Showing his face at all tied to the lore Atreus coming back confirmed????
: Dragonslayer Pantheon Chroma Texture Update (Pantheon VGU?)
Pantheon with a beard??? I'm down for him to have one on his base skin/ across all of his skins. Especially if he is going back to being Atreus as that would be his way of showing himself as an individual/ beards are great for showing that a boyish characters has matured as a man and now Atreus is free of Pantheons' control and has seen the Targonian Aspects for what they are that he has grown from it. Beards are rarely represented in League roster too, stubble notwithstanding. {{champion:41}} {{champion:79}} {{champion:104}} {{champion:427}} {{champion:240}} {{champion:2}} {{champion:516}} {{champion:77}} {{champion:4}} {{champion:62}} {{champion:83}} {{champion:26}}
Adder (OCE)
: I genuinely don't understand why people are angry at this. The voice-over is objectively a vast improvement.
> [{quoted}](name=Satuurn,realm=OCE,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=X98dHf7i,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-07-18T04:49:29.541+0000) > > I genuinely don't understand why people are angry at this. The voice-over is objectively a vast improvement. On the base skin maybe it's an improvement but only because his VA has been expanded something which could have been updated using the original VA if the controversy never happened. But if Lees' other skin is going to get updated too then its a real tragedy. This voice is a bit too generic (monotone monk inflection, which represents tranquility) and Vic has that nasally aspect that makes the character. On the God skin it makes his superior attitude really come through.
: source?
> [{quoted}](name=SoultakerKatana,realm=NA,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=Rn3qUAIH,comment-id=00040000,timestamp=2019-07-18T21:13:48.764+0000) > > source? I dunno it was about a 2 weeks - month ago. You can check the red posts if you really want to find it. The summary is that the when zoomed all the way out the Runeterra webmap is flat but of course a globe is round. Shurima being on the equator means it should appear bigger when viewed on a proper globe because of how spheres work. This happens with maps of today too. Since the Earth is (more or less) a sphere, and paper or digital maps are 2 dimensional, there will always be some kind of distortion in projecting geographic information from one to the other. There are a variety of projections which can minimize this effect in different parts of the globe, or standardize it in a way that makes the resulting map more accurate or easier to use. However, it is unavoidable that any flat map will have some kind of distortion.
arowin242 (EUW)
: they actually already finished a story: {{champion:92}} and {{champion:157}} these 2 have settled their respective problem with eachother and have gone on to live on. (riven was allowed to live within Ionia, yasuo was cleared of his crime's and also allowed to live in Ionia again.) effectively, these 2 stories have already come to an conclusion, and are furthermore just side characters, unless they add a new chapter to their stories where they are both main characters. That's all
> [{quoted}](name=arowin242,realm=EUW,application-id=6kFXY1kR,discussion-id=W1GazqnL,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-07-17T20:56:43.368+0000) > > they actually already finished a story: {{champion:92}} and {{champion:157}} these 2 have settled their respective problem with eachother and have gone on to live on. (riven was allowed to live within Ionia, yasuo was cleared of his crime's and also allowed to live in Ionia again.) > > effectively, these 2 stories have already come to an conclusion, and are furthermore just side characters, unless they add a new chapter to their stories where they are both main characters. > > That's all I mean is that a good thing though. Yasuo launched in late 2013 meaning it took 5 years to get a resolution. Even though they are "side characters" which is debatable honestly they are still "popular characters" how long until we get stuff for Skarner, Aurelion Sol (destined to loom over Runeterra until the very end it seems), Singed, Olaf and all the other unpopular champs? In game it makes sense that Lux, Ahri and other popular champs get attention for skins they are being marketed to a group of players that are largely casual gamers and are uninvested in League compared to someone who bothers to read Universe. There is no reason the next round of comics should be about only popular champs (as good as the comics are {{champion:22}} {{champion:99}} {{champion:238}} I'd like to see round 2 look at other champs like {{champion:102}} {{champion:246}} {{champion:163}} {{champion:105}} {{champion:44}} {{champion:12}} )
FAAtheguy (EUW)
: What Runeterra actually looks like
Bio has confirmed this recently saying Shurima is bigger than it looks on the map
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mrmeddyman

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