Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: July 19
My other post was super long here so I'm just putting TLDR in separate post. Viktor and Jhin did not fall under the buff category according to Riot's Balance Framework, so why buff Jhin and not Viktor. And in the case of champs feeling bad, how does Riot determine who to buff if they aren't eligible for buffs according to the balance framework.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: July 19
Hello Meddler, before reading this wall of text, there is a TLDR and I had posted this a few days ago on the gameplay boards. This is just taking a look at applying Riot's balancing framework on Viktor and Jhin. TL;DR: Using Riot's Balance Framework, both Viktor and Jhin are not eligible for buffs and yet Jhin is getting buffs while Viktor isn't when (arguably) Viktor needs them more? In the case of champions feeling bad, how does Riot determine which champions to buff if they dont fall under their criteria? Link to Balance Framework: https://nexus.leagueoflegends.com/en-us/2019/05/dev-champion-balance-framework Riot did say that they created the Balance Framework to hold them accountable, so I thought I'd give it a go at it. Before I start, I am going to say that I am a Viktor main so of course there will be a bit of bias, but I still find these results kind of interesting anyway. Anyway, I was wondering that since Viktor felt kind of weak, I would use Riot's Balance Framework to see if he is eligible for buffs or not. So I went to u.gg (forgot where I heard this, but I think a rioter said its the site that matches their internal data the most) and globally checked the win rate of Viktor in each elo. This was done on 7/16/2019. I also included Viktor Top since a significant enough number of players played him top, so I did some math to include the total winrate of Viktor top and mid. After that I will have one exclusively done on mid lane Viktor since I do heavily favor Viktor mid personally. I still did one though combining Top lane Viktor simply because he was played enough to have a significant impact on the overall winrate and they also go for the same builds as mid Viktor. Anyway here are the results for mid and top combined by elo: Iron: 53.39% winrate with 118 matches Bronze: 51.19% winrate with 7224 matches Silver: 49.78% winrate with 31758 matches Gold: 49.97% winrate with 42608 matches Platinum: 48.61% winrate with 20890 matches Diamond: 47.45% winrate with 7205 matches (2.6% presence) Master: 46.08% winrate with 217 matches (2.8% presence) Grandmaster: 50.30% winrate with 330 matches (2.6% presence) Challenger: 47.2% winrate** with 125 matches (2.3% presence) Pro play: Do not know exact number, but I'm almost certain that it is below 5%, considering how uncommon he is seen in pro play. And here is Viktor mid exclusively: Iron: 57.14% winrate with 119 matches Bronze: 51.13% winrate with 7944 matches Silver: 50.4% winrate with 35203 matches Gold: 49.75% winrate with 46883 matches Platinum: 49% winrate with 22435 matches Diamond: 47.35% winrate with 7527 matches (2% presence) Master: 46.91% winrate with 194 matches (1.9% presence) Grandmaster: 50.38% winrate with 266 matches (1.6% presence) Challenger: 46.51% winrate with 86 matches (1.2% presence) So some things that interested me is that Viktor's winrate would decline the higher elo you are. I was somewhat surprised by this, considering Viktor is a moderately hard champion. However, I would disregard Iron, simply because of its absurdly low sample size. One theory I have on why Viktor has a good winrate in low elo is because people in that elo rarely ever see a Viktor and do not know how to deal with one. Especially since most people that play Viktor are probably mains due to his low pick rate (around 2-3% overall). But the higher elo you go, the more game knowledge players have, and know how to exploit Viktor's weaknesses harshly. Despite these numbers saying that Viktor does not need a buff, I would beg to differ based on another champion Riot is buffing the very next patch that does not need a buff according to their own framework: Jhin. So here are Jhin's winrates by every elo: Iron: 51.43% winrate with 1919 matches Bronze: 50.21% winrate with 112866 matches Silver: 50.25% winrate with 327930 matches Gold: 50.42% winrate with 291052 matches Platinum: 50.32% winrate with 103155 matches Diamond: 49.61% winrate with 24423 matches (9.2% presence) Master: 49.48% winrate with 382 matches (5% presence) Grandmaster: 44.23% winrate with 529 matches (4.1% presence) Challenger: 47.89% winrate with 142 matches (2.7% presence) Pro Play: Don't know, but probably super low. So according to Riot's own Balance Framework, Jhin does not need a buff either. So, why are they buffing Jhin? Probably because he does not feel so good to play at higher elos. Although it is less severe than Viktor's, Jhin's winrate does lower a bit the higher the elo you go as well. The patch notes even says "Adding some power into the part of Jhin's kit that rewards timing and coordination". In other words, they are rewarding skilled Jhin players who are able to more consistently hit their W root. So why not buff Viktor for high elo, considering that his winrate is far worse than Jhin's the higher the elo you go? Because the way his kit is designed, it benefits more in coordinated play. Due to 2015-2016 and Tank Viktor Top, Riot has been immensely cautious in buffing Viktor as they think that he could immediately become p/b in pro play. But the factors that made Viktor so strong in 2015-2016 are gone now (less mobility champs at the time, Rylais, etc.) and Tank Viktor Top will not come back unless they buff his Q (which they won't do). So they should be able to give Viktor mains buffs that help people who are experienced with Viktor without causing him to be OP in pro play. Now what should they do; I dont know for sure. But I am leaning on the idea of either buffing his early game a bit or some QoL buffs on his ult to make it not so impossible to get at least one tick on the enemy champion. That's just my idea, but the thing is is that both Viktor and Jhin don't feel the best to play atm in higher elos but neither of them fit Riot's balance framework requirements for a buff. And yet they decide to buff Jhin and not Viktor. Currently I feel like Viktor is 'meh' but DOES have room for some small buffs that will help experienced Viktor players. And if Riot decided to buff Jhin to help out more experienced Jhin players, then why not buff Viktor for experienced Viktor players especially considering that Viktor's winrate deteriorates far more harshly than Jhin's the higher the elo you go? Especially if its a small and yet useful buff?
: Your issue: Viktor is considered balanced for the lower elos (everything up to Plat). He's also a risk for bullying THE FUCK out of top lane if he's strong. Thus, he's not being buffed. If Jhin also had a risk of bullying the hell out of top lane and scaling into a late game threat while building tanky, he'd probably *also* not be buffed despite his weakening presence in higher elos. I'm upset that so many of you took the sheep way out and blamed it on favoritism and skin sales rather than using the information presented.
As long as Riot does not buff his Q, there is literally no risk of Viktor top making a comeback.
: {{champion:134}} Too scared to do anything with her because they fucked up during the mage update and everyone told them so but they didn't listen. She's barely seeing pro play and she's having a mediocre performance there and in solo as well.
It does feel like, with the exception of Anivia, that control mages are either suffering right now or just meh. All due to fear of pro play though.
: We all know the reason why Viktor went top; {{item:3025}} and Klepto. We all know the reason why these items aren't being made melee only and stopping stuff like tank Karma going top; {{champion:81}} . Even when Viktor went top and started abusing the shit out of everyone his mid lane stats were still 'meh' and he still suffered mid lane thanks to how Riot responded to his top lane presence. Viktor's been dog for multiple seasons at this point but he probably won't get buffed and if he is buffed it'll probably be done incorrectly knowing Riot.
Yea, I did feel like if they made IBG melee only, than Viktor top would have never been a problem. But as you said, Ezreal: Riot won't do anything that could hurt Ezreal too much due to his popularity. So even if I think they should make IBG melee only, they won't so long as Ezreal relies on it and isn't OP. If they ever did make IBG melee though, then they would have room to buff Viktor’s Q again. As for Viktor buffs, I do hold out hope that one day he will become good again, as every champ has their time. And who knows, a buff is still a buff; I'll take what I can get. Even without a buff, there could be other item or meta changes that will make him good in the future anyway. Who knows? Only time will tell.
: Your {{champion:35}} brothers stand with you!
Thanks! Hope Shaco gets what he needs as well.
Larriet (NA)
: >so I did some math to include the total winrate of Viktor top and mid You should list them both separately, not combine them. If one role is overpowered but the other isn't, hypothetically speaking, he should be nerfed regardless. Ideally, with nerfs that affect only the overpowered role or compensation buffs that help the role that isn't out of line. Look at Lux this patch: Her *overall* winrate is actually fine, but support specifically is too high, so it's important to separate her winrates by role. Her changes are nerfs that affect her overall, but the compensation buffs disproportionally help Midlane. So overall the Support role is being targeted, despite a "combined" winrate not being out of line. Keep in mind that I am speaking hypothetically; I'm not attempting to prove you wrong about Viktor, as I haven't looked into it myself and this may not be incredibly relevant. Just a heads up for future reference. Anyway, please do not combine the winrates, for the sake of your argument.
Edited that in, thanks for the feedback. Although I put one in on mid lane Viktor specifically, I'm still keeping the combined one simply because it does affect his overall winrate AND they go for the same build unlike Lux supp and mid.
NY64 (NA)
: Basically Riot punishes you for not maining a popular champion.
Rioter Comments
Meddler (NA)
: Instead of a regular champion roadmap our next couple of blogs will be detailed dives into how the Fiddle and Voli VGUs are progression as followup to the recent VGU voting. Will be a while until the next standard roadmap as a result. First Voli/Fiddle update should be pretty soon though.
Alright thanks for the reply. If you have time can you also answer my other question? If not, thats fine. Anyway, have a good day!
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: July 12
Also when is the next champion roadmap?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: July 12
Hello meddler, I was just wondering, if its possible, if you or riot could do a sort of weekly/monthly posting on the win rates of champions based on your guys internal data. Now I do not know how much work goes into it so sorry if that was asking a bit much, but the thing is most win rate websites differs from each other, leaving it uncertain of champions exact win rates, globally. I am asking this because me and probably many others think “oh this champ needs to be nerfed or buffed”. With the balance framework you guys recently released, people can take a look at that and the win rates based on Riot’s global data, and know which champions will get nerfed or buffed or for players to objectively show why this champ needs to be buffed/nerfed for sure since most stat sites are not 100% accurate and don’t have data collected globally.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: March 27
Hey meddler what do you think of Swain and Viktor right now? They both seem in an OK spot but could afford to have a littl more power to them. There is a pretext for this. In the past, when Lucian and Khazix were both OK-good you guys buffed them to make them good-god tier a while back. When a champion is at an OK state, what makes you guys decide to buff them, despite technically not needing one. Is it to make things interesting or shift the meta? Or perhaps because they have a high play rate? I am genuinely curious on what makes you guys buff some champions over others even if they are in an OK spot. But yeah in addition to that what do you think of Swain and Viktor right now and champs in a similar spot who are OK.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: March 20
Currently Viktor seems kinda OK to suboptimal but like Swain i think he has some room for a little more power to his early game. Bc the nerfs reduced his base dmg and increased his ratios, his mid-late is even better but his early game is pretty bad. Would you guys consider giving Viktor a tiny/small buff to his early game?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 20
Any plans/buffs/nerfs for AP Viktor coming soon or under consideration?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 15
Back when Viktor Top was broken, many people suggested removing the mana scaling on his Q and increasing the AP ratio on his shield would fix him. The reason you guys didn’t do this is probably because you wanted Viktor Top to still be viable. But don’t you think thats a little unfair for the players who enjoyed playing him mid? As long as Viktor Top can be viable, you guys(rightfully) do not have any room to buff AP Viktor. Although he is kinda balanced now he is still quite on the weaker side mid. Dont you think its unhealthy to have tanky mages in the game anyway(remember tank ekko and fizz). So is there any plans to kill Viktor Top to give room to buff Viktor mid or would you guys find a way to buff AP Viktor without making Viktor Top broken or are you guys ok with how weak he is right now?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 13
Do you feel like Jhin came out weaker from the crit item changes? If so, do you guys think he should be buffed or that he is fine just as he is right now?
Meddler (NA)
: Want to give him a bit of time post hotfix buff and as players continue to learn him. Possible he's still on the weak side, don't want to over react and buff unnecessarily if we can avoid it though.
If you guys did decide to buff him, what Buff are you guys likely to give him specifically?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: February 1
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 30
What are your thoughts on the current states of Sylas, Ornn, and Viktor? In terms of strength and whether they should he buffed or nerfed and in what ways.
Meddler (NA)
: No immediate plans for Viktor nerfs. If we did hit him it would be targeting top lane play specifically which is where we think power's potentially a problem. Might mean targeting something that mainly affects top (e.g. Q augment), might mean shifting power from something top uses better to something more neutral.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 25
Any plans to help AP Viktor and kill Tank Viktor?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 25
Hey meddler last week you said that you guys MIGHT consider nerfing Viktor again. If you do, would there be proper compensation to AP Viktor? Also to kill Tank Viktor(since its unhealthy and makes it hard to balance both Tank and Ap build) why not remove the mana scaling on his shield(compensating it with base or increased AP numbers on shield)or make Iceborn Gauntlet melee only? This would give room to buff AP Viktor. And in general are there any future plans to help AP Viktor? And do you guys think that Tank Viktor should be killed? After all mages being tanky in the past (ekko and fizz) usually cant be balanced.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 18
Hey meddler earlier in the week you said that you guys MIGHT consider nerfing Viktor again. If you do, would there be proper compensation to AP Viktor? Also to kill Tank Viktor(since its unhealthy and makes it hard to balance both Tank and Ap build) why not remove the mana scaling on his shield(compensating it with base or increased AP numbers on shield)or make Iceborn Gauntlet melee only? This would give room to buff AP Viktor. And in general are there any future plans to help AP Viktor?
: They can’t nerf tank Viktor without nerfing AP Viktor. Viktor can also build IBG regardless. Riot are stuck now that people have found out this IBG Viktor build. IBG Viktor doesn’t care about damage nerfs because all he cares about is perma slowing targets with Q. They can’t kill Tank Viktor without killing AP Viktor. That’s the problem.
Unless they remove the mana scaling on his Q and put more AP scaling or base values which would kill the IBG build. Or make IBG melee only which they cant because they love Ezreal far more than Viktor.
: > [{quoted}](name=Krozoid,realm=NA,application-id=A7LBtoKc,discussion-id=JeoGRXbm,comment-id=000e,timestamp=2019-01-16T16:45:27.082+0000) > > Viktor nerfs?? What?? This champ is absolute dog shit what are you going to nerf? Few months ago “TaNk ViCtOr Is ToO BrOkEn. PlS nErF.” Loses 20 base damage, “Viktor is absolute dog shit”
He is specifically talking about AP Viktor which DID get gutted. Kinda ironic that Tank Viktor is still viable while AP Viktor is doing quite badly right now. Wish they would kill Tank Viktor to make room for buffing AP Viktor.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 16
Hey meddler good morning! TL;DR(sort of, not really) Overall what are your thoughts on Viktor's current state, what are your guys future plans for him(if any), what do you think are Viktor's problems, and would you guys ever consider giving him a mini-rework? I just wanted to ask how you think Viktor landed with his earlier changes. Do you think that you guys will try to help AP Viktor some more? Because the changes so far seem to have hurt Ap Viktor more than Tank Viktor because of his weak early game. Do you guys intend to fix AP Viktor into a viable, but healthy, position anytime soon or will you just leave him alone for now? I feel like the main problem with Viktor isn't his damage numbers but the consistency of his damage. If Viktor was somehow able to consistently land his E aftershock and R ticks all the time, he'd be kinda broken with his current numbers. Most champions have a cc or slow spell of some sort if they have a spell that is hard to land. But the only thing Viktor has is his Gravity Field(W) and it isn't nearly enough as the slow is too low at low ranks and enemies can easily dash out of it. So maybe you guys could make Viktor's damage more consistent by decreasing E's aftershock delay, R tick rates and/or increasing R movement speed(adjusting damage numbers accordingly), or buff his W slow, or W size, or introduce a grounded effect on Viktor's W similar to Cassiopeia's. What are your thoughts?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 11
Hey meddler good morning! **TL;DR(sort of, not really)** **Overall what are your thoughts on Viktor's current state, what are your guys future plans for him(if any), what do you think are Viktor's problems, and would you guys ever consider giving him a mini-rework? ** I just wanted to ask how you think Viktor landed with his earlier changes. Do you think that you guys will try to help AP Viktor some more? Because the changes so far seem to have hurt Ap Viktor more than Tank Viktor because of his weak early game. Do you guys intend to fix AP Viktor into a viable, but healthy, position anytime soon or will you just leave him alone for now? I feel like the main problem with Viktor isn't his damage numbers but the consistency of his damage. If Viktor was somehow able to consistently land his E aftershock and R ticks all the time, he'd be kinda broken with his current numbers. Most champions have a cc or slow spell of some sort if they have a spell that is hard to land. But the only thing Viktor has is his Gravity Field(W) and it isn't nearly enough as the slow is too low at low ranks and enemies can easily dash out of it. So maybe you guys could make Viktor's damage more consistent by decreasing E's aftershock delay, R tick rates and/or increasing R movement speed(adjusting damage numbers accordingly), or buff his W slow, or W size, or introduce a grounded effect on Viktor's W similar to Cassiopeia's. **What are your thoughts?**
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: January 11
Also when is the next champion roadmap?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 7
Hey meddler good morning! I just wanted to ask how you think Viktor landed with his changes. Do you think that you guys will try to help AP Viktor some more? Because the changes so far are hurting Ap Viktor more than Tank Viktor because of his weak early game. Do you guys intend to fix this anytime soon or will you continue to see how he has landed this patch? What are your thoughts?
shofaz (NA)
: Thoughts on these Viktor buffs I made?
Hey meddler good morning! I just wanted to ask how you think Viktor landed with his changes. Do you think that you guys will try to help AP Viktor some more? Because the changes so far are hurting Ap Viktor more than Tank Viktor because of his weak early game. Do you guys intend to fix this anytime soon or will you continue to see how he has landed this patch? What are your thoughts?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 5
Hey meddler, good morning! I just wanted to ask what you think of Viktor's state right now? Do you think he is still too strong top? If that is the case, then how about changing his shield scaling from Mana and Ap to a flat base number (that scales with level or Q rank) with Ap scaling? Wouldn’t that fix all of Viktor’s problems and reward players more for building Ap and effectively kill Viktor top in one clean blow? The current changes going live today just doesn’t seem to address Viktor’s problems and even makes mid Viktor slightly weaker since he struggles so much early game. Just remove mana scaling and Viktor cannot build tank anymore. Simple.....right? What do you think?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 30
Hey meddler, good morning! To adequately nerf Viktor top without hitting mid, how about changing his shield scaling from Mana and Ap to a flat base number (that scales with level or Q rank) with Ap scaling? After all one of the reasons tank Viktor is a thing is because of the mana scaling on his Q. Remove that and Tank Viktor dies. Also couldn't you guys buff his E aftershock delay which would motivate players to go for E max mid Viktor? Thing is, I have seen many suggestions on Reddit and the boards to reduce Viktor's E aftershock from 1 second to 0.8-0.85 seconds with some damage number adjustments. Just curious, why would this not work? I have never seen a direct answer from Riot on why they simply cannot do this. If you are not sure, could you ask someone who does have experience/data/reasons on why Viktor's E can't be touched and get back to me? Thanks and have a good Friday!
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 28
Hey meddler, good morning! To adequately nerf Viktor top without hitting mid, how about changing his shield scaling from Mana and Ap to a flat base number (that scales with level or Q rank) with Ap scaling? Also couldn't you guys buff his E aftershock delay which would motivate players to go for E max mid Viktor? Thing is, I have seen many suggestions on Reddit and the boards to reduce Viktor's E aftershock from 1 second to 0.8-0.85 seconds with some damage number adjustments. Just curious, why would this not work? I have never seen a direct answer from Riot on why they simply cannot do this. If you are not sure, could you ask someone who does have experience/data/reasons on why Viktor's E can't be touched and get back to me? Thanks and have a good Wednesday!
Rioter Comments
shofaz (NA)
: WHY CAN'T YOU REDUCE VIKTOR'S E DELAY TO 0.8 SECONDS?????????????????
Hey meddler, good morning! I just wanted to ask what you think of Viktor's state right now? Do you think he is still too strong top? If that is the case, then how about changing his shield scaling from Mana and Ap to a flat base number (that scales with level or Q rank) with Ap scaling? Also couldn't you guys buff his E aftershock delay which would motivate players to go for E max mid Viktor? Thing is, I have seen many suggestions on Reddit and the boards to reduce Viktor's E aftershock from 1 second to 0.8-0.85 seconds with some damage number adjustments. Just curious, why would this not work? I have never seen a direct answer from Riot on why they simply cannot do this. If you are not sure, could you ask someone who does have experience/data/reasons on why Viktor's E can't be touched and get back to me? Thanks and have a good Friday!
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 9
https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/9tilly/my_thoughts_on_viktor_and_his_upcoming_nerfs/ This summarizes my thoughts on Viktor and what can be done for him. Your thoughts?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 7
https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/9tilly/my_thoughts_on_viktor_and_his_upcoming_nerfs/ This summarizes my thoughts on Viktor and what can be done for him. Your thoughts?
Rioter Comments
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 24
Hey meddler good morning. I just wanted to ask if Viktor top does get too strong what would you guys do? Instead of straight nerfing him would you shift some of his power from his Q into his E/R? I am also asking this because of the new shield rune from resolve. Viktor top is already good but with this rune I think it could potentially push Viktor into OP territory even with the time warp tonic change. What would you think of changing if Viktor does become too strong top?
Meddler (NA)
: No current plans to nerf Viktor because of his top performance. Will reassess post preseason changes of course, but seems ok so far at least?
Ok again thanks for the reply and have a good friday!
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 19
Hey meddler good morning. I just wanted to ask what you think of Viktor Top right now? For the first time in years he is actually truly viable in some way. I am asking because i want to know what direction you guys have in mind for Viktor. I don’t want to see Viktor nerfed especially since he is barely viable in the mid lane. Would you guys be ok with Viktor Top or would you guys try to shift some of his power to make him more viable mid lane? Would you guys look at him after preseason? Just gonna ask since I’m pretty sure u guys have already noticed so this post wont be the reason Viktor will be nerfed. Anyway thanks for any reply! And have a good Friday and weekend!
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 17
Hey meddler any plans for https://d1u5p3l4wpay3k.cloudfront.net/lolesports_gamepedia_en/a/a3/ViktorSquare.png .Even with the buffs he has been receiving they dont really fix his problems. Would you guys take a look at him after preseason? And any short term or long term plan for him?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 12
Hey meddler any plans for https://d1u5p3l4wpay3k.cloudfront.net/lolesports_gamepedia_en/a/a3/ViktorSquare.png .Even with the buffs he has been receiving they dont really fix his problems. Would you guys take a look at him after preseason? And any short term or long term plan for him?
shofaz (NA)
: Hey Meddler, thanks for the reply on Viktor from last Wednesday! On Wednesday you said that you were less confident about whether Viktor's E delay and R speed should or should not be buffed. Could you bring this up with a rioter with more experience/context on Viktor to see if he does need some buffs in this area? Because as I said before, it feels nearly impossible to land his E aftershock unless the enemy is already cc'ed and his R can't get more ticks off because of how slow it is now. With Rylai's rarely used on Viktor now, do you think that you guys could potentially do a partial revert of his E delay to where the delay is 0.8-0.85 seconds or his ult's ms is increased by 50? These things could help Viktor a lot and make it feel like it isn't impossible to get your damage off without them being chain cc'ed in a fight. And if you don't think any of these are needed, then what do you think is needed and what future plans do you guys have for Viktor in the short term and/or long term? Is there a chance you guys would take a look at him after preseason? Again I appreciate your time in answering these questions and for doing your Gameplay Thoughts! Have a good Wednesday!
Hey meddler any plans for https://d1u5p3l4wpay3k.cloudfront.net/lolesports_gamepedia_en/a/a3/ViktorSquare.png .Even with the buffs he has been receiving they dont really fix his problems. Would you guys take a look at him after preseason? And any short term or long term plan for him?
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 10
Any future plans and any thoughts on https://vignette.wikia.nocookie.net/leagueoflegends/images/a/a3/ViktorSquare.png/revision/20150105215536
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 5
Hey Meddler, thanks for the reply on Viktor from last Wednesday! On Wednesday you said that you were less confident about whether Viktor's E delay and R speed should or should not be buffed. Could you bring this up with a rioter with more experience/context on Viktor to see if he does need some buffs in this area? Because as I said before, it feels nearly impossible to land his E aftershock unless the enemy is already cc'ed and his R can't get more ticks off because of how slow it is now. With Rylai's rarely used on Viktor now, do you think that you guys could potentially do a partial revert of his E delay to where the delay is 0.8-0.85 seconds or his ult's ms is increased by 50? These things could help Viktor a lot and make it feel like it isn't impossible to get your damage off without them being chain cc'ed in a fight. And if you don't think any of these are needed, then what do you think is needed and what future plans do you guys have for Viktor in the short term and/or long term? Is there a chance you guys would take a look at him after preseason? Again I appreciate your time in answering these questions and for doing your Gameplay Thoughts! Have a good Friday!
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 3
Hey Meddler, thanks for the reply on Viktor from last Wednesday! On Wednesday you said that you were less confident about whether Viktor's E delay and R speed should or should not be buffed. Could you bring this up with a rioter with more experience/context on Viktor to see if he does need some buffs in this area? Because as I said before, it feels nearly impossible to land his E aftershock unless the enemy is already cc'ed and his R can't get more ticks off because of how slow it is now. With Rylai's rarely used on Viktor now, do you think that you guys could potentially do a partial revert of his E delay to where the delay is 0.8-0.85 seconds or his ult's ms is increased by 50? These things could help Viktor a lot and make it feel like it isn't impossible to get your damage off without them being chain cc'ed in a fight. And if you don't think any of these are needed, then what do you think is needed and what future plans do you guys have for Viktor in the short term and/or long term? Is there a chance you guys would take a look at him after preseason? Again I appreciate your time in answering these questions and for doing your Gameplay Thoughts! Have a good Wednesday!
shofaz (NA)
: Thoughts on these Viktor buffs I made?
Hey meddler, thanks for the reply on Viktor from Wednesday! On Wednesday you said that you were less confident about whether Viktor's E delay and R speed should or should not be buffed. Could you get a rioter with more experience/context on Viktor to see if he does need some buffs in this area? Because as I said before, it feels impossible to land his E unless the enemy is already cc'ed and his R can't get more ticks off because of how slow it is now. With Rylai's rarely used on Viktor now, do you think that you guys could _potentially_ do a partial revert of his E delay to where the delay is 0.8-0.85 seconds or his ult's ms is increased by 50? These things could help Viktor a lot and make it feel like it isn't impossible to get your damage off without them being chain cc'ed in a fight. And if you don't think any of these are needed, then what do you think is needed and future plans do you guys have for Viktor in the short term and/or long term? Again I appreciate your time in answering these questions and for doing your Gameplay Thoughts! Have a good friday!
Meddler (NA)
: So, just to set context, I'm not sure how much we should or shouldn't be buffing Viktor at present. I also haven't played that much Viktor myself, so while I'm happy to offer some thoughts on different approaches they'll be coming more from a place of theory than experience. AA range - I suspect that would add power more to Viktor's laning phase than teamfights looking at how changes to AA ranges have affected other champs in the past. If difficulty proccing Q is the issue to solve I'd just add a tiny bit of extra range to the Q empowered attack instead (or add a bit more if it's already got some and I'm unaware). That avoids adding extra power to his CSing and base AA harass in lane if that's not desirable. Q and W haste/slow - For arguments like these I'd start with an assessment of what Viktor's strengths and weaknesses should be, then look at how the current state of those abilities does or doesn't match those targets. Without doing that too high a risk of just pushing in power without consideration of what the desired outcome beyond 'stronger' is. W damage amp - Highly skeptical of this one. Team damage amps tend to be extremely strong, particularly if they're AOE and/or immediately applied. Satisfaction for them is generally pretty low though, relative to their power. I'm not aware of player desire or kit needs that would push Viktor towards being more ally dependent, so I can see thematic argument for this approach but not much else. E delay and R speed - This is a case where I'd need to play against Viktor in his current state more to speak with any confidence. Rylai's is certainly a much more niche item on him than it used to be, so it's possible tuning for needed counterplay has changed. At the same time though Viktor's historically had some really reliable damage output, so I'd be somewhat hesitant to strip counterplay out. Again though, this is one I feel least confident about answering. R control during stasis/death - Death I don't think's the right call at all. With rare exceptions (zombie passives) once you've killed an enemy champion they're deliberately unable to actively retaliate against you and I think that's an appropriate rule. If we were making Viktor today could see some argument for having his ult vanish on death instead, probably wouldn't make that change though given it's been this way a long time. From memory functions it that way in large part because Tibbers continued to exist post Annie's death and Viktor R's prototype started with a copy of Annie R. Reactivation during stasis is an ongoing topic for us internally. Zoe was a test case for whether we should potentially be making reactivation abilities useable while stasis'd or CC'd. Debate on whether that's been a good thing that we should apply to other reactivateable abilities or something we should strip off Zoe continues though.
Ok thanks for the reply! And if you felt not so confident on answering some of these questions could you ask a rioter who would for sure have the context/experience for these and get back to me? Again though thanks for the reply!
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shofaz

Level 193 (NA)
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