Flamdron (NA)
: Shaco Late Game
his scalings have been nerfed so late game isn't too good but he can still do things like pick off lone champions, apply pressure to lanes by splitpushing and getting vision in enemy jungle, and rushing late drakes with his R
: Point and click abilities
Only thing that needs to be changed on Vlad is his early healing on minions. it should be reduced to 50% healing until maxed
: Give eve pure stealth if you're going to keep these jungle changes...
Ok first off, any champion can abuse Tiamat, and in fact it was recently indirectly nerfed on his because of his base ad nerfs. Secondly, Eve has mage itemization with incredible sources of damage and built in shred, if she didn't have camouflage, she'd be 100% pick/ban,
: wtf happened to shaco to make him so bad again?
His E ap ratio got nerfed from 70% to 60%, his box duration got nerfed, his base ad and growth got nerfed. That's all the nerfs to reworked Shaco. The firsy suggested changes to his E were about 190 damage max rank and 85% ap ratio, it would have been insane, but old Shaco had incredible base damage and ratios, 210 base damage and 100% ap ratio, and with the passive on top of that, it'd deal 252 base damage and 120% ap ratio.
: Shaco is really over powered
Tbh he Is one of the most unsafe assassins out there. Every other assassin has some kind of escape, Ekko has his R, Rengar gets tons of movement speed, khazix gets resets and up to 3 R uses, Eve has her untargetable R, Fizz has good mobility, Zed has his shadows, Qiyana has a leap with almost no cooldown, Akali has 4 gapclosers, 3 movement speed buffs and invisibility, Pyke has insane gapclosing and escape potential, Talon has a 1 second terrain leap, Kayn can literally PASS through terrain and go inside someone for like 4 seconds, Wukong is like Shaco, he has no disengage, LeBlanc is like Zed with the blinks and stuff, and then there's Shaco… He has a blink with invis, once that shit's gone he has NOTHING else besides a 2 second arm time box which will be one shot by anything and maybe his ult to try stop the enemy.
: But the mains will tell you he is the weakest champion ever and he needs serious steroid injections.
> [{quoted}](name=Total Violation,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Ppqa3WEj,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2019-11-16T04:05:37.781+0000) > > But the mains will tell you he is the weakest champion ever and he needs serious steroid injections. no Shaco main wants that lmfao, we're all fine with how he is atm, I just wish there was some way to lower his ban rate and stop these crying boards posts without effecting his damage or gameplay.
: but does darius are rammus have the ability to jump over a wall? cause shaco can just q over a wall. he is a great split pusher better than most tbh just because he is safe with split pushing. im not saying hes broken beyond repair. he was always good at splitting.
> [{quoted}](name=RyzeRework,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Ppqa3WEj,comment-id=0008000000000000,timestamp=2019-11-19T04:27:47.993+0000) > > but does darius are rammus have the ability to jump over a wall? cause shaco can just q over a wall. he is a great split pusher better than most tbh just because he is safe with split pushing. im not saying hes broken beyond repair. he was always good at splitting. I respect that you're not straight up saying he's broken like most players, but I am saying that after he uses his Q and you chase him with an oracle. wtf an he do? his box will be destroyed in 0.1 seconds and he can maybe use his R if it's still up, but since he'll be using it to take turrets and he uses Q, you'll know what one is the clone and not to target unless he does the max range tether trick.
: Remove Shaco from the game.
: Shaco is prolly one of the better split pusher tbh with boxes and stealth he is nearly unkillable.
> [{quoted}](name=RyzeRework,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=Ppqa3WEj,comment-id=00080000,timestamp=2019-11-17T17:46:56.190+0000) > > Shaco is prolly one of the better split pusher tbh with boxes and stealth he is nearly unkillable. He's good at split pushing yes but his boxes will only provide him a short fear to escape, and when he uses his Q, you pop your oracle and follow him because do you really think he'll be able to 1v1 someone like Galio or Darius or Rammus chasing him down? his Q is on like a 6 second cooldown with MAX cdr and within that 6 seconds his squishy ass can be demolished.
: More proof that Shaco needs to be hammered down.
His winrate is usually high late game because of his ganks early game, he can get his laners ahead and when his fed laners get their items in the late game, it's gg. Shaco himself does perform weaker than pre rework late game simply because ALL of his scalings have been dropped. his E ad ratio was dropped by 40% late game and his Q ad ratio was dropped by 15%, then his ap side, the ap ratio on Q was removed and the ap ratio on his E was dropped by 15%. It's safe to say his late game burst *was* dropped by a ton after his rework.
: Shaco still needs nerfs
A majority of Shaco players do well because of the enemies stupidity. Yes he's very oppressive early but if you can drag the game out long enough, he will fall off and perform pretty much worse than all other champions in the game. He can only get kills late game if the enemy split pushes alone or gets separated from their team. As for his stealth, release Shaco had a 5 second stealth at all ranks, 2016 pre rework Shaco had 3.5 seconds at all ranks, and now he starts at 2.25 seconds, the range has been shortened and the length has been shortened. The goal of his rework was literally to make him an early game champion so they cannot change his stealth at all. His clear speed has already been slowed down a lot so that can't be touched either. As for you saying the nerf did nothing, I highly doubt it did nothing but get rid of his level 3 cheese, it has harmed ALL of his laning power.
: [GAMEPLAY] Shaco's clone does not copy his laugh/taunt/joke/dance
it does his dance, but it doesn't do his laugh, taunt and joke. It never has. Also his joke has no animation.
: Would Shaco passive be better if it gave some CDR(.5-1) instead of damage when striking from behind?
Absolutely not, doing this slows down his clear speed even further. After the rework his clear speed has dropped by a lot so completely removing the damage and the burst from his auto's and damage from his E would be absurd, horrible suggestion.
Lemons22 (NA)
: Why does Shaco need execute damage?
if they remove his execute damage then they need to buff his base damage and/or ratios. Which tbh would be way stronger. Also his old execute was absolutely terrible, so they turned it into something that is actually noticeable.
: Trundle, please help him
Shaco got the buff/rework because he didn't function as an assassin. He had no base damage or scalings so even when he build assassin he didn't do much except auto attack. So they had to give him power somewhere, in this case, the early game.
: [GAMEPLAY] Shaco Q (Deceive) is not visible in fog of war
This doesn't sound like much but is actually a pretty big deal. Hope Riot fixes this!
: Is shaco ap or ad
Shaco can be played as anything tbh. Ad, Ap, Crit, Tank. It's just preference.
: > [{quoted}](name=HA I am Shaco HA,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IJgrioLW,comment-id=0018,timestamp=2019-11-07T16:03:55.859+0000) > > The point of the update was to make ap Shaco playable, and your point about him taking out a quarter of an adcs hp level 1 is absolutely pointless because it's always been like that so they can't nerf it. Also another one of your points asking Ap Shaco to be shut down is also pointless is because this was their main goal, to make Shacos builds as good as each other. the fact that he can be played as a support that has an ability that shuts down entering bushes? irrelevant. the fact that both AD and AP shaco can be played in different lanes with 53%+ winrate, irrelevant. AP shaco having no counterplay vs Melee champs since his boxes fear through red trinket and control wards? the fact that his clone is now a remote controlled shock drone that explodes into an instant AOE crowd control allowing him to towerdive and teamfight? irrelevant. you ignoring these glaring issues just makes it apparent that you're just defending the champion out of personal bias. its insane how many shaco players will keep misleading people by saying the point of the update was to make something viable. if that one thing that's being made viable is broken even in concept then it shouldn't be in the game. you're arguing moot points because when you talk about the champion's strengths as AP then it becomes apparent that this champ shouldn't have such flexibility to begin with. its the same reason why they ripped mechanics out of newly reworked champions like irelia and akali, taking away their mini stuns and auto disables, taking away their heal on Q and shieldbreak on passive. the update made shaco overtuned, and there is simply no argument against it. It isn't the first time a "quality of life" gameplay update has created sizable imbalance in the game, and it would continue to happen if they don't recognise their mistake with this rework's AP aspect. if this was a post about how tryndamere shouldnt be both AD and AP you woundn't say anything.
> [{quoted}](name=Aatrox Eichmann,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=IJgrioLW,comment-id=00180000,timestamp=2019-11-07T20:42:20.954+0000) > > the fact that he can be played as a support that has an ability that shuts down entering bushes? irrelevant. the fact that both AD and AP shaco can be played in different lanes with 53%+ winrate, irrelevant. AP shaco having no counterplay vs Melee champs since his boxes fear through red trinket and control wards? the fact that his clone is now a remote controlled shock drone that explodes into an instant AOE crowd control allowing him to towerdive and teamfight? irrelevant. you ignoring these glaring issues just makes it apparent that you're just defending the champion out of personal bias. > > its insane how many shaco players will keep misleading people by saying the point of the update was to make something viable. > if that one thing that's being made viable is broken even in concept then it shouldn't be in the game. > you're arguing moot points because when you talk about the champion's strengths as AP then it becomes apparent that this champ shouldn't have such flexibility to begin with. its the same reason why they ripped mechanics out of newly reworked champions like irelia and akali, taking away their mini stuns and auto disables, taking away their heal on Q and shieldbreak on passive. > the update made shaco overtuned, and there is simply no argument against it. It isn't the first time a "quality of life" gameplay update has created sizable imbalance in the game, and it would continue to happen if they don't recognise their mistake with this rework's AP aspect. > if this was a post about how tryndamere shouldnt be both AD and AP you woundn't say anything. Explain this to me, how can I be bias if I was explaining Riots goals and what *they* wanted. I didn't say what I myself thought.
: can we just address AP shaco already
The point of the update was to make ap Shaco playable, and your point about him taking out a quarter of an adcs hp level 1 is absolutely pointless because it's always been like that so they can't nerf it. Also another one of your points asking Ap Shaco to be shut down is also pointless is because this was their main goal, to make Shacos builds as good as each other.
Undine6 (NA)
: Last shaco box nerf too much? 60 seconds to 40
I feel like they should change the duration from 40 to 45 and increase the time ratio ever so slightly, lane Shaco feels absolutely useless now when it comes to actually supporting their adc. Before his rework his boxes is what MADE him some what playable as a support, and to have them nerfed THIS hard feels pretty bad. As for his jungle clear, the level 3 clear is still doable but a little slower, it requires good timing.
: URF Reminded me of something
they capped his boxes on URF for a reason. Also with what you're saying it sounds like you want them to remove his boxes entirely.
Xalioth (EUW)
: Shaco Clone hail of blades
Shaco's clone copies the stats that Shaco currently has, so it works with lethal tempo too but it's not as good. I don't think this is a bug though because this is literally how Shaco's clone is supposed to work.
: I found FIDDLESTICKS suitable instrument for his Login Theme Song
: For how much longer must shaco and khazix be free wins in solo q?
Shaco just received a large nerf to all lanes and a fairly decent nerf to his early jungle clear. Kha'zix on the other hand I have no problem with, there's ways to play around him.
B0ak (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=SnackerMore,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=ZunXfXMl,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-22T21:36:23.266+0000) > > yes I am aware of that. So why are you complaining, this is good for you. ?XD 1. I'm not exactly complaining. 2. It's not good for me because I main this champion.
> [{quoted}](name=B0ak,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=ZunXfXMl,comment-id=00000000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-24T19:30:52.603+0000) > > 1. I'm not exactly complaining. > 2. It's not good for me because I main this champion. I main Shaco too, 450k points total. However you can still do the level 3 clear, but it's slightly shittier. https://youtu.be/_I3-OQNTJIk
B0ak (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=SnackerMore,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=ZunXfXMl,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-10-22T17:57:51.139+0000) > > he can still do the level 3 gank, but a lot slower and less healthier. Yes, however by this point the lane he is ganking is no longer level 1.
> [{quoted}](name=B0ak,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=ZunXfXMl,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-22T18:02:46.889+0000) > > Yes, however by this point the lane he is ganking is no longer level 1. yes I am aware of that. So why are you complaining, this is good for you. ?XD
Weexazys (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=SnackerMore,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qlEZmObY,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-10-22T17:57:01.653+0000) > > your jungler can definitely gank a Shaco, just ask them to buy a control wards and sweeper before they gank. Shaco was playable as a support before the buffs, it's just he's more viable as a support now. Buy a control ward and sweep, they now know the jglr is here and back off, your jgl either wastes more time trying a bait or just goes off without anything anyways 1 min after botlane is full of shaco boxes again? Tell me a jglr that wont just simply ignore all this wasted time and simply try to gank mid or top.
> [{quoted}](name=BarcodekiIIer,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=qlEZmObY,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-10-22T18:47:27.683+0000) > > Buy a control ward and sweep, they now know the jglr is here and back off, your jgl either wastes more time trying a bait or just goes off without anything anyways 1 min after botlane is full of shaco boxes again? > > Tell me a jglr that wont just simply ignore all this wasted time and simply try to gank mid or top. you say this like Shaco boxes are invincible, also Shaco will most likely always push his lane up to the enemy turret and hope the jungler ganks, however this is good for YOU because when his boxes get destroyed he gets completely dicked by you.
B0ak (NA)
: He is getting a nerf in the next patch. His boxes are getting gutted and he will no longer be able to abuse an early level 3 gank like he has.
> [{quoted}](name=B0ak,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=ZunXfXMl,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-10-22T17:22:11.171+0000) > > He is getting a nerf in the next patch. His boxes are getting gutted and he will no longer be able to abuse an early level 3 gank like he has. he can still do the level 3 gank, but a lot slower and less healthier.
Weexazys (NA)
: Playing as and ADC has been the most frustrating, infuriating role forever.
your jungler can definitely gank a Shaco, just ask them to buy a control wards and sweeper before they gank. Shaco was playable as a support before the buffs, it's just he's more viable as a support now.
: what counters shaco bot lane?
your support buys a red trinket level 1 and sweeps out his early boxes, you avoid the bushes and never tunnel vision for a kill on him. Try remembering where he has placed his boxes, that helps a ton. Also when he tosses his E face towards him to negate like 17 damage in the early game.
: Middlesticks was nerfed like a hot potato, but Garen and Shaco get a slap on the wrist
The Shaco wasn't a slap on the wrist, it fucks all his lane play throughout the entire phase, it fucks his early clear which is drastic due to him not being able to do old paths.
: Why wait for Garen and Shaco "nerfs" instead of hotfixing them?
RiotAzuBK has already stated that they aren't hotfix worthy, however they ARE guaranteed to be nerfed, that should be good enough. Especially when it's hard nerfs.
OuttaVoid (EUNE)
: lmao....im playin bot lane a lot of time now...where the fuk did u see the shaco support mains i am wondering....hardly i have see 1 shaco support bfr his buffs that are just annoying and make him op in a lane that doesnt make sense...
> [{quoted}](name=OuttaVoid,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=69zlERjR,comment-id=00000000000100000000,timestamp=2019-10-19T19:26:16.294+0000) > > lmao....im playin bot lane a lot of time now...where the fuk did u see the shaco support mains i am wondering....hardly i have see 1 shaco support bfr his buffs that are just annoying and make him op in a lane that doesnt make sense... Because support Shaco mains are rare, of course you won't see a lot of them. Also when you say he's op in lane, 90% of losses against him are because of the enemy unable to buy an oracle, avoid fighting/chasing him, and not being able to remember where he is boxing.
: > [{quoted}](name=Master2139,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=69zlERjR,comment-id=0016000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-19T03:13:07.988+0000) > > in what way, all his damage was out of abusing items, his scalings were decent at best. {{champion:28}} {{champion:245}} {{champion:121}} {{champion:107}} litterally all have better late game than shaco did in terms of damage, on top of that aside from eve all their early games were either on par or better than shaco's. All the ones you used rely on ult to do any burst at all. Shaco's engage is a fraction of the cd. And abusing items is what hypercarries do. Ekko jungle has be a constantly nerfed anomaly much like Camille jungle. Kha'zix and Evelyn have significantly weaker early games around contesting crab since they can't take ignite like shaco can. As Kha'zix and Evelynn your entire existence before lv10+ revolves around praying the enemy Yi/Warwick/Volibear/Pantheon/Xin Zhao/Udyr does not find you while invading your jungle. Shaco simply drops boxes around points he can get engaged on and blinks out with stealth on a significantly lesser cd. Chasing a half decent Shaco around the jungle is a fool's errand. Rengar is virtually a kamikaze assassin with a terrible late game if he didn't get fed to hell by overextended idiots. Once he's used his ult to engage on a target he has no escape whatsoever and with his usual build he doesn't have the staying power to not get deleted, which is why he's called the lesser Khazix's, who at least has his multiple stealth charges and leap, even though they're considerably longer cd than Shaco's toolkit. Shaco deletes half your health from stealth and doesn't even require you to be isolated to do so, while having multiple escape options and a betetr version of leblanc's clone.
> [{quoted}](name=Crescent Dusk,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=69zlERjR,comment-id=00160000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-19T04:03:07.667+0000) > > All the ones you used rely on ult to do any burst at all. Shaco's engage is a fraction of the cd. And abusing items is what hypercarries do. Ekko jungle has be a constantly nerfed anomaly much like Camille jungle. Kha doesn't need ult to oneshot, Rengar doesn't need ult to oneshot, Eve doesn't need ult to one shot and neither does Ekko. Kha just needs isolation for a MASSIVE damage increase on his abilities, Rengar can hide in a bush which is basically everywhere, Ekko doesn't require anything, Eve can pop out of infinite stealth and oneshot you with mage itemization.
: Support Shaco has (had) no "mains". Maybe 1 person. No exaggeration. Works very differently from top or jungle Shaco. Unless a main is less than 50 games on him in a season. That being said, I am being so hard on him because if you're taking flash on him as Support you're wrong so rethink your decision - and Its my personal opinion this guy does not deserve to be in the support role anyway. He should be like "Support MF" pretty trash and maybe in the right comp can work but never be mainstream for the health of the game. Yet here he is. He's a fun jungler champion but get him out of this lane.
> [{quoted}](name=Kiwi Lemonade,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=69zlERjR,comment-id=000000000001,timestamp=2019-10-17T23:23:46.865+0000) > > Support Shaco has (had) no "mains". Maybe 1 person. No exaggeration. Works very differently from top or jungle Shaco. Unless a main is less than 50 games on him in a season. > > That being said, I am being so hard on him because if you're taking flash on him as Support you're wrong so rethink your decision - and Its my personal opinion this guy does not deserve to be in the support role anyway. He should be like "Support MF" pretty trash and maybe in the right comp can work but never be mainstream for the health of the game. Yet here he is. He's a fun jungler champion but get him out of this lane. "Support Shaco has (had) no 'mains'. " I'm 100% sure it does, there are a lot of Shaco support players I know of, even if they don't play it all the time. "That being said, I am being so hard on him because if you're taking flash on him as Support you're wrong so rethink your decision." Ok explain to me how I am "wrong" to take flash on him. Flash is by far the strongest sum spell in the game, yes I can take exhaust ignite but then if I use Q to avoid enemy poke, I have lost all of my getaway power. "He should be like Support MF pretty trash" He was like that pre rework, Shaco mains only wanted his E to be changed to magic damage and get increased damage, instead riot has gave us this entire list of changes that made him very good as support and has caused Shaco to lose 15% ap ratio on his E, gain a broken asf execute, an unfair starting clear and him being viable as support which has caused him to lose 20 seconds duration on his boxes. none of this would've happened if they had only gave us what we wanted.
: Ah yes, the 500% increased playrate of “mains” playing him since the last patch.
> [{quoted}](name=Z3Sleepier,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=69zlERjR,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-17T20:49:32.099+0000) > > Ah yes, the 500% increased playrate of “mains” playing him since the last patch. A lot of his mains came back because it was what they wanted since his 2016 assassin rework
iSennª (NA)
: > [{quoted}](name=SnackerMore,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BsNgvgAe,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2019-10-16T16:07:31.657+0000) > > you probably play ranged top laners, your opinion is not welcome here. My opinions is not welcome ? I play Quinn and I hope for the day Riot rework her so she can function as marksman bot lane because no I don't enjoy to be pigeon holed top lane to face melee . Instead of being that kind of fool who judge, think behind the image of what you see…
> [{quoted}](name=Quinn Is Bae,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=BsNgvgAe,comment-id=00010000,timestamp=2019-10-16T22:33:55.933+0000) > > My opinions is not welcome ? I play Quinn and I hope for the day Riot rework her so she can function as marksman bot lane because no I don't enjoy to be pigeon holed top lane to face melee . Instead of being that kind of fool who judge, think behind the image of what you see… Even Quinn in general is bad enough, I spit on that champion. I have never been more suicidal facing that champion when she was the highest winrate in Top, Mid and Bot.
: You're telling me. He also went from 0.5% PR Support with ~47% winrate to a 2.5% PR Support with a 55% winrate. Just an 8% winrate jump don't mind me I'm just an invisible clown able to forgo flash take ignite and exh like a Yuumi and still not get punished because there are 20 boxes in bottom lane ready and piping for enemy jungler so I can get a triple.
> [{quoted}](name=Kiwi Lemonade,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=69zlERjR,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-10-17T10:34:33.820+0000) > > You're telling me. He also went from 0.5% PR Support with ~47% winrate to a 2.5% PR Support with a 55% winrate. > > Just an 8% winrate jump don't mind me I'm just an invisible clown able to forgo flash take ignite and exh like a Yuumi and still not get punished because there are 20 boxes in bottom lane ready and piping for enemy jungler so I can get a triple. 2.5% playrate is mostly his mains, and only some Shaco players will take exhaust on him, others like myself will take flash. Also his boxes are being nerfed, he can only place 3 boxes in lane now, so you can stop crying about this so called 20 boxes.
Saevum (NA)
: Stealth duration should be more like: 2/2.3/2.6/3.0/3.5 And maybe reduce E ap ratio a little. Played him recently and it felt really good. Like, i don't play him at all and i was rewarded for just picking him.
> [{quoted}](name=Saevum,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=69zlERjR,comment-id=0003,timestamp=2019-10-17T13:50:45.259+0000) > > Stealth duration should be more like: 2/2.3/2.6/3.0/3.5 > > And maybe reduce E ap ratio a little. > > Played him recently and it felt really good. Like, i don't play him at all and i was rewarded for just picking him. his E ap ratio has already been dropped by 15%
iSennª (NA)
: Revert Shaco to 9.19 state
you probably play ranged top laners, your opinion is not welcome here.
: Bring Us Your Bugs!! Celebrating 10 Years of LoL
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/569243337551511554/633725589798518804/unknown.png
: Please no more "shacos/garens" next patch
: Champs got hofixed for less in the past (garen/shaco)
: > [{quoted}](name=SnackerMore,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=sG6qEctE,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-14T14:07:45.971+0000) > > the nerf is only his starting clear, you will still need to adapt to him. might be a good start his early cheese bot lane is insane.
> [{quoted}](name=Ninja Anubis,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=sG6qEctE,comment-id=0000000000000000,timestamp=2019-10-14T14:29:00.207+0000) > > might be a good start his early cheese bot lane is insane. only reason it's insane is because nobody has a brain and doesn't treat him like he's Twitch ganking level 2.
: > [{quoted}](name=SnackerMore,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=sG6qEctE,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-10-14T11:46:51.753+0000) > > just don't be stupid early game and put deep wards down. other than play safer and more carefully early game, his counters are the same as last time. You can build defense items because his base damage is still pretty low, you can invade him to ruin his entire clear and giving your jungler a massive advantage or even your laners if you kill him considering he usually doesn't have flash, you can invade him and take some of his camps especially now because he will often clear his full red side allowing your jungler to invade his blue and take everything. So to sum it up, don't be stupid early game, invade him level 1, build early defense items like seekers armguard if you're a mage. hope this helps! Well he is confirmed to get nerfs next patch so yay.
> [{quoted}](name=Ninja Anubis,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=sG6qEctE,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2019-10-14T12:17:01.769+0000) > > Well he is confirmed to get nerfs next patch so yay. the nerf is only his starting clear, you will still need to adapt to him.
: Confirmed nerfs coming soon
thankfully Shaco is only getting his starting clear nerfed
: So what is the counter to this new shaco buffs?
just don't be stupid early game and put deep wards down. other than play safer and more carefully early game, his counters are the same as last time. You can build defense items because his base damage is still pretty low, you can invade him to ruin his entire clear and giving your jungler a massive advantage or even your laners if you kill him considering he usually doesn't have flash, you can invade him and take some of his camps especially now because he will often clear his full red side allowing your jungler to invade his blue and take everything. So to sum it up, don't be stupid early game, invade him level 1, build early defense items like seekers armguard if you're a mage. hope this helps!
: Shaco is broken just follow pro builds that match what you need for the game
> [{quoted}](name=letsfeedtogether,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=pcX2KO3L,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-10-11T23:31:45.912+0000) > > Shaco is broken just follow pro builds that match what you need for the game adc mains be like.
: > [{quoted}](name=QancerClown,realm=EUNE,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AtEET3AT,comment-id=,timestamp=2019-10-12T14:15:07.872+0000)We cannot start to nerf and buff him > Yeah no. He's getting nerfed next patch, Scruffy confirmed it on his Twitter account.
> [{quoted}](name=SweedishGunner,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=AtEET3AT,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2019-10-12T14:29:44.338+0000) > > Yeah no. He's getting nerfed next patch, Scruffy confirmed it on his Twitter account. the nerf *is* his starting jungle clear.
DeadGator (EUW)
: Shaco ap is stupid
you should just ban him if you don't like him that much, I can't be bothered explaining how stupid you've made yourself sound by saying you were almost killed by 1 box from 2000hp, the box should've done 500 minimum. you can literally just run away from it.
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HA I am Shaco HA

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