: More valuable than winrates and people who don't know that correlation doesn't equal causation. 100% of people who breathe die.
You've kind of got this backwards. The winrates have a lot more weight to them since they are looking at many thousands of games whereas your personal experiences are only based on a handful of games. As with anything, you really need to look at a whole bunch of data in order to draw any conclusions.
: Yeah, and from playing her she's still very powerful. No one consideres her a handicap, drop the self pity. Sej isn't even bad at clearing and ganking early and only gets stronger as the game goes on.
I mean the statistics dont really lie, Sejuani is not preforming well right now across all elos. Maybe you have had some positive experiences lately playing as/with Sej but shes still the worst preforming jungle champion in the game right now and needs some work done.
: Sej is still quite powerful.
She has been ~44% winrate since 9.19 with a low playrate. It's been a while since Sejuani wasnt considered a handicap for your team.
Comentários de Rioters
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: December 5
Hi Meddler, could you provide any insight into the changes coming to Sejuani, specifically, is she receiving just number changes still like what was on the PBE not too long ago or have/are you guys looking at possible changes in the form of an ability rework/revert? Thanks for any information at all.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: November 9
Hi Meddler, could you possibly say if a revert is on the table for Sejuani? There is a lot of support for a Sejuani revert and I would like to know if it's even a possibility. Thanks for any information at all.
Valkyrie (EUNE)
: Anything on sejuani? in 8.23 ? 8.24 ?
Hey, just letting you know that since this has been post both Riot Maple and Riot Meddler have made a comment about how they are trying out changes for Sejuani. Here's the links to those comments: Maple: https://www.reddit.com/r/leagueoflegends/comments/9ur82c/patch_822_notes/e979ljz/ Meddler: https://boards.na.leagueoflegends.com/en/c/developer-corner/hpAdqhBw-quick-gameplay-thoughts-november-7?comment=00030000 As a Sejuani main, I'm so hyped to see what they are testing out.
Acanthus (NA)
: What this guy said. I didn't play old sej as a tank, I played her as the rare ap bruiser because, back then, diversifying your damage types was a major advantage. She only had hard cc on her ult and a minor stun/displacement on her q, but she could slow and she had **damage**. We're not talking crazy burst (although you could actually do that if you wanted to be completely squishy), but like space aids type damage where she would steadily chew through your hp if left alone. The difference being that you had to be on top of them to actually accomplish that. Her weaknesses were pretty clear too. She was very kitable, though if she caught you, she'd probably stay on you between iceborn and her e slow. Though you did have time to find a wall to flash or cc her, or depending on positioning, get saved.
> [{quoted}](name=Acanthus,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=w4QTioej,comment-id=0008000100000000,timestamp=2018-11-01T17:42:19.780+0000) > > What this guy said. I didn't play old sej as a tank, I played her as the rare ap bruiser because, back then, diversifying your damage types was a major advantage. She only had hard cc on her ult and a minor stun/displacement on her q, but she could slow and she had **damage**. We're not talking crazy burst (although you could actually do that if you wanted to be completely squishy), but like space aids type damage where she would steadily chew through your hp if left alone. The difference being that you had to be on top of them to actually accomplish that. Her weaknesses were pretty clear too. She was very kitable, though if she caught you, she'd probably stay on you between iceborn and her e slow. Though you did have time to find a wall to flash or cc her, or depending on positioning, get saved. You put it extremely well, this is how I played Sejuani also. I hate the notion that old Sejuani was a weak champion without her ultimate, her basic abilities were extremely underrated by a majority of the player-base. Like you said, if you weren't properly peeled you could melt the back and front line because of the many ways you scaled throughout the game with enemy max HP damage, damage based on your HP, good AP scaling and good base damages; all this with well defined weaknesses like you said. She wasn't just a straight CC tank like she is now, she was an amazingly fun AP bruiser who could be played a multitude of different ways such as a bruiser diver, an almost assassin if you wanted to go that path, a tank who focused on peeling, and many other ways. Hell, a good amount of players even played her support. She was just so diverse with what you could do and I really dislike how those options were taken away from her, turning her into a one-dimensional CC bot.
: Revert her. I don't give a shit about the LCS.
> [{quoted}](name=MarkedOfKane,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=w4QTioej,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2018-10-31T22:08:22.876+0000) > > Revert her. I don't give a shit about the LCS. Agreed, I cant see how Riot could possibly make Sejuani's current kit balanced with just number tweaking; she either needs another rework of atleast 1 or 2 abilities or a simple revert. I know everyone likes to complain about how weak old Sejuani was outside of her ultimate but there is no denying that she was a much more fair and balanced champion with that kit.
: Even if she really is in a pretty bad spot right now, I prefer this situation millions of times over back when she could perma CC an entire team all by herself while only spending ridiculously small amounts of mana each time. IMO, she should definitely get either a full revert or a whole new rework. Buffing her back right now is by far the worst outcome possible for a lot of people.
> [{quoted}](name=ThePaffLegacy,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hxwWkoGv,comment-id=0009,timestamp=2018-10-25T22:38:42.349+0000) > > Even if she really is in a pretty bad spot right now, I prefer this situation millions of times over back when she could perma CC an entire team all by herself while only spending ridiculously small amounts of mana each time. > > IMO, she should definitely get either a full revert or a whole new rework. Buffing her back right now is by far the worst outcome possible for a lot of people. Yeah I agree, I cant see how Riot could tweak her current kit enough to make it balanced. Buffing this current kit would just make her a dominant jungler again who feels terrible to play against. Like you said, the only real options are a revert or, at minimum, changing her E into a completely different ability but that still might not be enough changes.
: And how is that a bad thing? Really hope she's never meta again
> [{quoted}](name=Marothennan,realm=EUW,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hxwWkoGv,comment-id=0005,timestamp=2018-10-25T19:30:38.657+0000) > > And how is that a bad thing? Really hope she's never meta again Exactly, you hate the kit as it feels completely unfair to play against when it is strong. This is why im looking for answers as to what Riot is planning to do to make Sejuani a more fair and balanced champion while also making her more enjoyable for the people who actually like the champ.
: if you look at Japan she has a 66.7% winrate and a 1.3% playrate,if you look at Korea she has a 52.8% winrate with a .5% playrate and if you look at Turkey she has a 63.6% winrate and a 2.7% player. all of these numbers are in diamond+ I do not have a point but I wanted to point this out so that's my point.
> [{quoted}](name=boricCentaur1,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hxwWkoGv,comment-id=0004,timestamp=2018-10-25T19:26:45.348+0000) > > if you look at Japan she has a 66.7% winrate and a 1.3% playrate,if you look at Korea she has a 52.8% winrate with a .5% playrate and if you look at Turkey she has a 63.6% winrate and a 2.7% player. all of these numbers are in diamond+ I do not have a point but I wanted to point this out so that's my point. Im not sure where you are getting those statistics but the only stat that I could find that is close to the numbers you listed is the Japan winrate, where Im seeing a 69.57% winrate in Diamond+ (lolalytics.com) but that is over a whopping 23 games which is nowhere near a big enough sample size to have any meaning whatsoever. No champ has had as high of winrates as you are claiming since Skarner when he was reworked in the juggernaut update. You have to keep in mind how many games are being accounted for when you look at statistics or else you will get absolutely crazy varying numbers such as the ones you cited.
: > [{quoted}](name=inaujes,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hxwWkoGv,comment-id=00000000,timestamp=2018-10-25T18:45:22.190+0000) > > Thanks I'm trying not to bring much arguing to this post, I just really want some details on how Riot plans to fix Sejuani; similar to how Riot has been actively communicating with the Karma player base, providing insight into their thinking about proposed ways to fix Karma and now explaining their intentions with the current changes. i actually liked the old sej, i don't really like the new one.. i never played either much, but the old one was fun. ( i messed with it in season 4/5 for a very short period of time)
> [{quoted}](name=SwiftKitten88,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hxwWkoGv,comment-id=000000000000,timestamp=2018-10-25T19:14:18.234+0000) > > i actually liked the old sej, i don't really like the new one.. i never played either much, but the old one was fun. ( i messed with it in season 4/5 for a very short period of time) Yea I loved Old Sej, my favorite champion of all time in this game hands down. I actually have a post I made about a week ago comparing Old and New Sej and detailing how they basically deleted Old Sej from the game that you might be interested in. I've tried again and again to make New Sej work for me but the difference in playstyles is unfortunately almost too much to handle. I do think with the right tweaks Riot could change Sej into having a playstyle more similar to her old kit while keeping aspects of her new kit that New Sej players have come to love; this rework idea posted over on the Sejuanimains subreddit is really good IMO and would blend her old and new kits into one, hopefully, fair, balanced, and fun kit https://www.reddit.com/r/sejuanimains/comments/9dahy7/my_idea_for_sej_rework/
Madsin25 (NA)
: Atleast sejuani mains in high elo have decent winrates with her.(55%) Meanwhile trundle sitting at a 47% WR across 200 games with his mains. THANKS LCS!
> [{quoted}](name=Madsin25,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hxwWkoGv,comment-id=0001,timestamp=2018-10-25T18:47:15.003+0000) > > Atleast sejuani mains in high elo have decent winrates with her.(55%) > > Meanwhile trundle sitting at a 47% WR across 200 games with his mains. > > THANKS LCS! I'd actually argue that it's kind of a bad thing high elo Sejuani players have a decently high winrate with her, it just shows how much coordination is needed in order to utilize her kit properly. According to lolalytics.com, Sejuani sits at a 54.5% winrate in Master+ while if you look at the next lowest skill level of Diamond+ she already drops to 44.3% winrate. That drop is huge and indicates that even with a bit less coordination, Sejuani's impact on the game drops dramatically. Sej is just so gated by the need to have a reliable team that she feels terrible to play in solo queue and she needs some fundamental kit changes so that she is able to do things on her own easier and isn't broken with a coordinated team.
: when you come into the thread expecting to prove the person wrong... but they actually have a valid argument backed by proof and grounded in reason. {{sticker:zombie-brand-clap}} {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}}
> [{quoted}](name=SwiftKitten88,realm=NA,application-id=3ErqAdtq,discussion-id=hxwWkoGv,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-10-25T18:33:23.009+0000) > > when you come into the thread expecting to prove the person wrong... but they actually have a valid argument backed by proof and grounded in reason. > {{sticker:zombie-brand-clap}} {{sticker:slayer-pantheon-thumbs}} Thanks I'm trying not to bring much arguing to this post, I just really want some details on how Riot plans to fix Sejuani; similar to how Riot has been actively communicating with the Karma player base, providing insight into their thinking about proposed ways to fix Karma and now explaining their intentions with the current changes.
Comentários de Rioters
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 24
Hi Meddler, what are the current plans for Sejuani? She is in dire need of work and us Sejuani players havent heard anything news concerning our champ in quite a while. Thanks.
Meddler (NA)
: Quick Gameplay Thoughts: October 19
Hi Meddler, are there any current plans for Sejuani? Would love to hear what Riot plans to do with Sejuani, she is in desperate need of buffs/changes. Thanks for any info.
Cowseed (NA)
: I agree!! AKALI WAS AN ALL OR NOTHING DIVING ASSASSIN!!! NOW SHE'S A LITTLE HIT AND SKUTTLE AWAY BITCH!! WHAT IS MOST UPSETTING IS SHES MY SECOND HIGHEST MASTERY CHAMPION. DO YOU KNOW HOW IT FEELS WHEN YOU LOAD INTO A GAME WITH THAT MASTERY 7 ICON ON THE CHAMP YOU THOUGHT YOU KNEW BUT THEN HAVE NO IDEA WHAT SHES ABOUT? THATS WHAT I FEEL. I WOULD LIKE TO LEARN THE TRICKS OF THE NEW AKALI BUT I CAN NOT BARE THE SHAME OF HAVING UNEARNED MASTERY POINTS ON THIS COMPLETELY NEW CHAMP. Let me reset the Master damnit!!!
> [{quoted}](name=Cowseed,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=hLXWRO7h,comment-id=0008,timestamp=2018-10-19T15:06:42.010+0000) > > I agree!! AKALI WAS AN ALL OR NOTHING DIVING ASSASSIN!!! NOW SHE'S A LITTLE HIT AND SKUTTLE AWAY BITCH!! WHAT IS MOST UPSETTING IS SHES MY SECOND HIGHEST MASTERY CHAMPION. DO YOU KNOW HOW IT FEELS WHEN YOU LOAD INTO A GAME WITH THAT MASTERY 7 ICON ON THE CHAMP YOU THOUGHT YOU KNEW BUT THEN HAVE NO IDEA WHAT SHES ABOUT? THATS WHAT I FEEL. I WOULD LIKE TO LEARN THE TRICKS OF THE NEW AKALI BUT I CAN NOT BARE THE SHAME OF HAVING UNEARNED MASTERY POINTS ON THIS COMPLETELY NEW CHAMP. > Let me reset the Master damnit!!! I feel you there buddy. Might be a tad unrelated but I really dislike Riots trend of changing easy to hit abilities (point and click, damage damage in aoe around your champ) to skillshots. I know that point and click abilities are harder to balance, look at Sejuani's new E for an example of an obnoxious point-and-click, but I feel that a lot of champions are getting more difficult to play. For example Akali went from a relatively simple assassin with 2 point-and-click abilities, 1 ability that did damage around your champion and didnt have to be aimed, and simple bonus effects on autos to a decently complex champion who needs to maneuver around a fight properly in order to use her passive and has 3 (4 if you count each part of her ult) skillshots and youve now got a champ with a noticeably higher skill-floor. Its a trend Im sad to see because some people just arent that great mechanically and it seems with each new rework, a champion who was a great pick for these players leaves the champion pool.
: > [{quoted}](name=inaujes,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=hLXWRO7h,comment-id=00000001,timestamp=2018-10-19T06:49:18.536+0000) > > While that is true, I feel that her lore fits her old kit better. From Riots brief description of Sejuani over on her universe.leagueoflegends.com page it states "Sejuani herself spearheads the most dangerous of these attacks from the saddle of her drüvask boar Bristle, using her True Ice flail to freeze and shatter her enemies" which perfectly describes her old playstyle, diving in and leading her team into battle. Current Sejuani might initially lead her team into a skirmish but currently she is in no way designed to stay in the fight like she should be, being the leader of one of the toughest tribes in the unrelenting Freljord. One of the fiercest warleaders out there and currently she has to rely on going in briefing and quickly getting out, playing more like a scavenger than someone who wants to be in the thick of the battle, which is evident through some of her quotes such as: "Trust nothing but your strength." "Trample them!" "Fight or make room for those who will.""I will not hide behind another shield." "There is no strength in servitude." ... I mean i'm not too sure how you play sej but she's a cc-heavy tank. I can't think of a reason why you'd keep going in and out of teamfights. If anything her new kit encourages her to follow her lore more. She has to work with her team to lock opponents down (team AAs and she stuns) But yes I suppose her old passive made it easier for her to stay in fights while the new one does nothing after you lead the charge.
> [{quoted}](name=BlueVestGuy,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=hLXWRO7h,comment-id=000000010000,timestamp=2018-10-19T07:03:43.701+0000) > > ... I mean i'm not too sure how you play sej but she's a cc-heavy tank. I can't think of a reason why you'd keep going in and out of teamfights. > If anything her new kit encourages her to follow her lore more. She has to work with her team to lock opponents down (team AAs and she stuns) > But yes I suppose her old passive made it easier for her to stay in fights while the new one does nothing after you lead the charge. I encourage you to try to play Sejuani as a front line tank right now, she is not very tanky at all once her passive goes down. She takes a good amount of time to get her CC out as she has to stack her E in order to deliver some actual CC, which can be very hard to do if you dont have reliable melee auto-attackers as teammates; how does it make sense for someone who says "there is no strength in servitude" and "trust nothing but your strength" to be reliant on her team if she actually wants to accomplish anything?
: p sure riot consider a champion's identity to go beyond their gameplay So appearances, lore and stuff too Doubt there's been a rework that hasn't kept at least 1 of those, so in their book the champions remain
> [{quoted}](name=BlueVestGuy,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=hLXWRO7h,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-10-19T06:32:56.889+0000) > > p sure riot consider a champion's identity to go beyond their gameplay > So appearances, lore and stuff too > Doubt there's been a rework that hasn't kept at least 1 of those, so in their book the champions remain While that is true, I feel that her lore fits her old kit better. From Riots brief description of Sejuani over on her universe.leagueoflegends.com page it states "Sejuani herself spearheads the most dangerous of these attacks from the saddle of her drüvask boar Bristle, using her True Ice flail to freeze and shatter her enemies" which perfectly describes her old playstyle, diving in and leading her team into battle. Current Sejuani might initially lead her team into a skirmish but currently she is in no way designed to stay in the fight like she should be, being the leader of one of the toughest tribes in the unrelenting Freljord. One of the fiercest warleaders out there and currently she has to rely on going in briefing and quickly getting out, playing more like a scavenger than someone who wants to be in the thick of the battle, which is evident through some of her quotes such as: "Trust nothing but your strength." "Trample them!" "Fight or make room for those who will.""I will not hide behind another shield." "There is no strength in servitude."
Comentários de Rioters
VoHagen (NA)
: I was apparently reported on my main for smurfing just because i went 23/3 with Wukong

Heimerdinger Bot

Nível 117 (NA)
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