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: @Riot August: Response to Morgana Gameplay Update Request Tweet
Lol I’m dumb, I just made a similar post but I saw yours with the exact same message. Here are my suggestions: My few critiques to her current kit would be that ulting in team fights in the late game feels extremely underwhelming while ults in skirmishes and the laning phase feels almost oppressive so maybe a mechanic that encourages multiple target ults instead of single target. Like a shorter duration on the stun delay for multiple targets and a longer delay for fewer targets. Also... W, I’m not sure what you can do to make it more satisfying to use this spell without adding power considering her q and e are very strong but the charge system that was on the fake leak seemed really interesting and maybe just shorten the overall duration for compensation.
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: w8 he has a ponytail
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Infernape (EUW)
: The reason why varus got so much backlash is that they retconned a champion that already had an established background.
And it happens all the time, really ALL the time. Why is this one different?
: NO this game is doing much better with representation, you need to stop thinking of YOU and start thinking of the young dudes/dude-ettes with no LGBTQ role-models in the HETERO games/stories they are over-saturated with daily. The countries with explicit anti-gay rhetoric aren't worth parroting, Riot is doing amazing and Neeko is the latest cherry on top
I completely agree and that what I’m arguing, representation is important and those who dismiss aren usually the ones already represented. I think you should read my whole post before commenting because I’m definitely for these stories and not against.
Hotarµ (NA)
: >But Varus' story had been done countless of times, Yeah, but the whole sacrificial-tool of vengeance was an interesting take on it that made him a unique prospect, similar in a way to Kalista, but ultimately unique nonetheless. Riot easily could have just modernized his story and fleshed it out more, but they changed a fundamental aspect of it and I'm still indecisive about how I feel about it. For the most part, there isn't an elephant in the room. I think the majority of players just geniunely _don't care_ about the sexuality of characters as long as it isn't shoehorned in or alters an already existing character in any way. That's my take on it, at least. I think Xayah & Rakan's relationship is interesting although somewhat dull on the surface, Neeko's addition of being lesbian just doesn't really add any weight to her story (not that it's a particularly bad thing, per say), and interestingly enough I couldn't find official confirmation of Taric being gay. That's odd, I always assumed Riot confirmed he was homosexual but I guess not. Either way, I _think_ he's gay, but again, doesn't really add much to the story. I'd personally like to see more fleshed out backstories instead of sexualities being tacked on, you know?
I completely agree, but I'm arguing that because changes happen so often why was Varus SUCH a big deal? I'm not gonna sit here and say I feel targeted because I don't but there are subtle things that go on in League communities that suggest that there is an elephant in the room. I think people DO have a problem with the story being gay and yet we don't talk about it. The funny thing about sexuality is that people say it shouldn't play a major role and that it should be normal but when it's treated normal it's described as being tacked on. I do respect you approaching this tactfully than others and you're right it isn't a big deal to have gay characters but I think representation is huge for everyone and if a few pronoun changes can do that for people then why not?
The Iceborn (EUNE)
: This is still just a game its not a novell, a relationship or sexuality preferences are a nice touch but you all give it waaaaaay too much importance... Who cares? Nobody does.. Do you think people play Varus while wondering what this champions sexuality is? No they dont all they care about is who has stronger abilities.. Yall need to drop this topic of sexuality because its annoying and extremely irrelevant to MOST players as most players dont care about Lore
I think you're oversimplifying things. It is a game which is why it's nice to not give a shit about lore and just play, but if you do have interest in the lore (which is why we're in story, art, and sound) then why should it matter? I think representation is important but have such a distaste for a gay story suggests that "you all" care just as much does it not?
: Xayah and Rakan are also annoying asf (and I'm straight). Who the fuck flirts during battles that hard? That being said, I don't want oversaturation in showing the gay characters. Why? Cause after a while it gets annoying. Same thing would happen if every champ started flirting, but at the gay champs it would be a little more annoying because, like it or not, they are still a minority under 5%. That's just my point of view, call me whatever you want and downvote the shit out of me if you want.
Dude... I genuinely just want to talk about this and thanks for your input. I already said that Xayah and Rakan were not handled well and over saturation isn't a problem when 2 out of 141 are gay. That is 1.4% which is less than the number you put up. Varus doesn't flirt and yet his story is highly hated so that doesn't really add to the discussion. I'm talking about representation not expression. If you don't think a champ should be gay even if they don't express that in the game, then that's okay but that is what you're saying.
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: I'd say remove the staff altogether, and make Zephyr her W companion be more fleshed out, and have her just cast from her hands or through Zephyr maybe.
I really love the idea of expanding on zephyr, especially since she is wind spirit that sometimes take form in a blue bird with the new lore update. I don’t know how I feel about removing the staff though. I didn’t talk about it in the post but I think an iconic thing about Janna’s model is that her shape very tall and slim and her staff adds to that. It could improve her identity of it were removed but I’d definitely feel like something would be lost in the process. Who knows, maybe it would be for the best.
: Haha, was meant as a joke. clearly went over 3 people's heads. But yeah, i think she should wear as little clothing as she does now. It's kinda part of her design at this point, there's tons of things that could be added though. there should be a whole bunch of loose cloth imo, to put more focus on her wind theme. Aside from that she's a wind spirit/goddes (yes i'm aware she's never called a goddess but ffs she's worshipped) and i think her clothing kinda fits the whole thing. When looking at alot of old religious art, nudity is prevalent.
No, I got the joke. But it did bring up an interesting question about her clothing so thanks for the input!
: Please Update Janna
What do you want updated? My personal complaint would be the hair mostly, I could live if the other things were not addressed.
: Honestly I'd rather that she have shorter but still messy hair. I think it suits her better since she's now an ocean/wind spirit who's adapted to Zaun. I did some doodles of a possible redesign with that in mind... Might share.
That’s so cool! I’d appreciate if you did. Leave a link if you make your own post.
Sukishoo (NA)
: I think she's still fairly modern, considering what she used to look like on release http://orig04.deviantart.net/5f8c/f/2014/149/b/0/janna_old_by_aaa_nymphea-d7kaju0.jpg
Are you saying you didn’t like banshee Janna?
: tiddies.
So do you think she should wear little clothing like she does now or does it matter as long as there’s a cut in the outfit for cleavage?
: https://cdnb.artstation.com/p/assets/images/images/005/957/851/large/thomas-randby-janna2.jpg?1494988425)[/img] This is pretty much perfect addresses all those concerns and brings her into the modern era
So is this what you would like to see? I can’t lie, I do like the fade effect.
: "You need not follow, but you must witness." Azir radiates such power with this voice line.
{{champion:203}} : “Lamb, tell me a story.” “There was once a pale man with black hair who was very lonely.” “Why was he lonely?” “All things must meet this man, and so they shunned him.” “Did he chase them all?” “He took an axe and split himself in two. Right. Down. The. Middle.” “So he would always have a friend?” “So he would always have a friend.”
: {{champion:26}} Is in the same boat in terms of the ice cream stiff hair.
Oh wow, you right. Was this a style back then or did early RIOT just have a hard time with animating hair?
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: man, i sure do love that there _skin lore_ hoo boy i could make posts asking about it on boards all day, me, a normal player who does not work here i bet the one guy who writes for skins would love to talk about it more on boards, where i, a player who is not the skins writer, eagerly anticipate the next big skOH GOD PLEASE SOMEBODY ASK ABOUT THE SKIN LORE
Kinda late to the party, but I have a few questions if you’re still up for it. 1. Steel Legion skin line, what’s Garen’s and Lux’s purpose and are they in the same universe as other skins? 2. Does Pantheon allow Morgana in his kitchen? 3. Does Forcast Janna and Announcer Draven work for the same network? 4. Are all traditional skins within the same universe? 5. Pumpkin head Fiddlesticks and Hecarim, any relation?
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: I'm actually more intrigued by his interactions with Kayle and Morgana... Darkin relationship for those two confirmed?
My theory is that the Darkin were once gods but were corrupted (maybe by the void considering his lines with voidlings). The gods saw this corruption and sought to contain it by sealing the Darkin into weapons (ancient artifacts that the trickster gave them). Morgana and Kayle seem to have either failed to ascend to goddesses or they fell from their status. I don’t think his quotes are him hating on Morgana and Kayle specifically but all “gods” in general since we has multiple lines with Pantheon, Taric, Zoe, Anivia, and Illiaoi. Another theory is that Morg and Kayle are being singled out in these voice lines and they just might be Darkin who have been cleansed of their affliction. In one of the Darkin lores it is said that there are only 5 Darkin left and one is a female Darkin with red hair. This woman could be Kayle and the last Darkin could be Morgana. It’s a stretch but I don’t feel like RIOT would tell us about the fourth Darkin if it didn’t mean anything. But who knows, maybe “red head Darkin” could be a new champ down the road.
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: Exactly. It's not that a support assassin isn't a good idea, it's that this kit feels like an assassin with tacked on aspects to make him a support. He's like how Skarner was made to be a "neutral objective controller" by forcing him to only be able to get his stats while near rocks that are placed ONLY in the jungle.
The only thing stopping you from solo laning is his waveclear and some people have already suggested builds for that. I dont understand everyone’s issue with this champ? If you want to play him as an assassin then go ahead, this honestly feels like the reverse of Karma. Early game Karma is a beast in a solo lane but falls off drastically and goes into a support role. Pyke will have a shitty laning phase but eventually scale. That’s just the way his kit works without any safe way to wave clear. He’ll be support like during the early game which can be nice if you get ganks because of how much cc he has. Later on you’ll be able to solo, you just got to play the game differently than other assassins. God forbid an assassin be different from the current ones.
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FilDaFunk (EUW)
: Why is her kit not satisfying? Her RQ has great damage, she has a root, relentess poke and a shield with a speedup. Her kit is not unsatisfying. Please explain.
Her R gives the illusion of options when really there is a right choice and a wrong choice. Her RQ is amazing in the early game but falls of drastically and her choices quickly dwindle down to RE in team fights with no other choices imo. Lulu delivers ten times better on the duality thematic that Karma has with having abilities can be used for allies or enemies. If Karma had the option to use her R+ abilities for enemies or for allies I feel like she would have some better choices. I also did not describe the ebb RQ better. The initial burst is essentially offensive still but the after affects are to make it so you didn’t waste an ult as a support only to damage the back line and not help your dying allies. The idea was RQ flow = most offensive, RQ ebb = very offensive with some defense, RE flow = very defensive with some offense, RE ebb = most defensive.
FilDaFunk (EUW)
: 1. Passive needs a new name{{champion:267}} Possibly yin/yang variation. 2. Q: choosing to heal or damaging with her q seems to be tricky to aim - more so if we'd have to ult to heal (possible waster if it's a skillshot) Why exactly does she need a rework? A shield bomb is the only real addition here.
I personally think there’s a better way to deliver on her gameplay because it lacks in being satisfying.
: what exactly is wrong with Karma?? She fits in the meta, has great visuals, and shes even versatile... Why would riot change any aspect of Karma over: {{champion:32}} {{champion:1}} {{champion:36}} {{champion:9}} {{champion:10}} {{champion:85}} {{champion:82}} {{champion:54}} {{champion:80}} {{champion:68}} {{champion:62}} {{champion:45}} {{champion:8}} {{champion:77}} {{champion:110}} {{champion:26}} {{champion:25}} {{champion:31}} {{champion:42}} ... Or any of the other champions they promised to update? Like, some of these guys have ugly models, some suffer with incomplete updates, and a few are drastically in need of reworked kits.
“Suffer with incomplete updates” - literally Karma... but no she isn’t worst offender but it’s somethinng I was passionate about sooo why not?
: Karma main checking in. This is a bit overloaded. I love the overall concept, however. LOVE the RQ and Passive. However, like someone else said I think her RE feels a little Janna-y. Maybe have damage and a slow instead of a damage and a knockback when it's in flow? Then it's the exact opposite of shield and MS boost. For her W, I have an idea: W - FOCUSED RESOLVE: Karma tethers to an enemy or ally champion. If tethered to an enemy champion, deals damage to them over a period of time (I'd just say same damage and time as what's on live) with a root at the end (also same as what's on live). When tethered to an ally champion, speeds them up and increases attack speed. RW - RENEWAL: Karma tethers to an enemy or ally champion. If tethered to an enemy champion, slows them, damages them, and decreases their armor and magic resist for a period of time, and roots them at the end. If tethered to an ally champion, speeds them up, heals them, increases attack speed, and increases armor and magic resist.
Thanks! That means a lot from a fellow Karma main. I think I shouldn’t try and force the passive into every R+ ability but I want there to be decisions other than RQ in laning, RW for surprise healing (no one thinks about it in a 1v1), and RE for initiation and second locket. I’m cautious to just give the e the option because I feel like RE shield Bomb will always be better than RQ which should not be the case. You’re right though, the current one up at the top is too Janna-y so there needs to be work done. THANKS AGAIN!!!
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Hópe (NA)
: Dont think giving adcs more damage is necessarily the right way to go. Its already frustrating to fight a Lux in bot because if shes winning lane she can just E spam which is extremely infuriating to fight against.
You’re right, she can get very spammy but doesn’t it seem odd that she’s the only mage with a purely defensive ability? No damage, no utility, just a shield. I think because of this, her e and r are very oppressive which can result in uninteractive gameplay. Her power budget is uneven and this is just a suggestion as to how to fix that.
: Her laning is already to annoying. It's like Xerath but safer.
That’s for mid, this is mostly for support Lux.
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: Im certainly of the opinion that Zed will be updated this time, I would eat my own shorts if he's not. I mean surely he has equal chance and better reason to be updated with Irelia than with Akali. Oh and yeah art has to be the biggest thing to look foward to imo. The territory of Ionia has to be the least flesh out among the three contenints. The modern Ionia setting has superior world building potential compared to the old lore.
Akali is much more closely related to Zed than Irelia. Akali works along side with Shen and their stories revolve around each other. Irelia’s story seems to focus on Ionia’s changing views on violence and the Noxian invasion. I don’t think Zed would be involved much in that. However, he could still get a lore update easily.
: What are the character fantasies that each of the champions up for a VGU should offer?
I love the thought provoking thread. That being said, my two champs I’m most invested in are {{champion:20}} and {{champion:9}}. {{champion:20}} - There are many partnerships in league like Annie with Tibbers, Kayn with Rhaast, and Quinn with Valor... the list goes on. I think we have yet to see a truly dependent relationship. A relationship where the two don’t just make a good team or try to use the other for power but truly rely on one another (you can argue Annie relies on Tibbers but with the new lore it seems more like a connection to her mother cause Annie’s a bad ass on her own). I want to see Nunu and Willump need each other with the upcoming VGU. Willump can protect Nunu from the elements and beasts while Nunu can provide companionship to an outcast yeti or something like that. {{champion:9}} - This one’s gonna be odd so brace yourself. Fiddlesticks’ niche would seem obvious (scary scarecrow) but there are many terrifying champions that also fill the spoopy champ role and so he needs more than just fear to play into his character. Fiddlesticks always came across to me as someone who is patient. He stands in his field for years on end with no disturbances, but that changes once someone crosses into his domain. Just like in nature, there are season in life and Fiddlesticks waits for the harvest. Those who stay on the land quickly being to have nightmares and see things. They become overwhelmed with fear as the physical toll starts to show with baggy eyes and grey/falling out hair. Fiddle quite literally saps away their life only to come in at the final moment to reap what he has sewed into those unlucky to come across the harbinger of doom. Or something like that.
Ifneth (NA)
: I have mixed feelings about this choice. Taliyah being a real and somewhat common name, the baby will not have a strange name or feel their name is entirely after the champion. However, being named after a fictional character that she will probably never experience only because her parent liked that character could feel awful or even be harmful. For example, -It could unconsciously subordinate the relationship between parent and child to the relationship between parent and character. -It will often make the child think of the character when anyone calls her name. She will also sometimes compare herself to Taliyah. -The child make not like the character. The little sparrow is wonderful, but not everyone may find her endearing. -The parent will eventually stop playing League of Legends and may change mains before then. The child will never lose the name. Is that fair? -She may tell her classmates about how she was named and then be teased about it. All bullies need is an excuse. It’s probably best to change plans and give her a name not based on a fictional character, sharing your love for Taliyah with her in a way that lets her choose whether and how much to engage, rather than figuratively branding her for life before she’s even born.
> [{quoted}](name=Ifneth,realm=NA,application-id=yrc23zHg,discussion-id=LYbApq7w,comment-id=0000,timestamp=2018-02-15T11:08:23.022+0000) > > I have mixed feelings about this choice. Taliyah being a real and somewhat common name, the baby will not have a strange name or feel their name is entirely after the champion. However, being named after a fictional character that she will probably never experience only because her parent liked that character could feel awful or even be harmful. For example, > > -It could unconsciously subordinate the relationship between parent and child to the relationship between parent and character. > > -It will often make the child think of the character when anyone calls her name. She will also sometimes compare herself to Taliyah. > > -The child make not like the character. The little sparrow is wonderful, but not everyone may find her endearing. > > -The parent will eventually stop playing League of Legends and may change mains before then. The child will never lose the name. Is that fair? > > -She may tell her classmates about how she was named and then be teased about it. All bullies need is an excuse. > > It’s probably best to change plans and give her a name not based on a fictional character, sharing your love for Taliyah with her in a way that lets her choose whether and how much to engage, rather than figuratively branding her for life before she’s even born. Lol, you’re dissecting things too much. It’s a beautiful name and it brings the mom joy so why not? My cousin was named after the white power ranger cause it was his older brothers favorite character at the time. He’s fine today and Andrew isn’t a terrible name. You can voice concerns but don’t say “You should change YOUR CHILD’S name.” That’s their choice not yours, back off a bit.
Reav3 (NA)
: The problem with that is we wouldn't want to force though a bad design. When we are in early ideation we generally try out kits on a couple of different champions, and there are times when we end up hitting a dead end on a specific champion and pivot to something else. This is why I don't mention a VGU in my roadmap until after we have a solid thematic and kit direction we feel confident we will release. If we started on a Champion chosen by the community and then we couldn't fins a strong direction and had to cancel the project or picot to something else it would probably upset people quite a bit. We do however have survey data on what the most requested VGUs by our players are that we use to determine which champions to start ideation on.
I can confirm that 95% of those VGU requests are me ranting on about Fiddle. In all seriousness, you guys do an amazing job and thank you for being so forward with all the recent information.
: If I recall, Morg's kit will stay basically the same. I would dig up the comment from Meddler (I know he said this), but that would take WAY too long.
Unfortunately, he’s right. She’ll keep her painfully straight forward and easily telegraphed kit for the most part. I just wish the changed her e and r.
Dªy (EUW)
: God its going to take forever till they get back to redoing Shen after they said they were unsatisfied with his thematic... I really cant wait a set amount of years.
Imagine being a Karma main....
: ~*Akara, The Gun Mage*(Champion design i'd like to see)~
Yes!!!!! I agree that there needs to be a black female character. Kinda odd how league has quite a few ethnic female champs ranging from Asian ({{champion:103}} ), Pacific Islanders ({{champion:420}} ), South American ({{champion:76}} ), Middle Eastern ({{champion:163}} ), and Western Asian ({{champion:43}} ) but no black women. A+ post
Naymliss (NA)
: Tbh, I think fiddle needs a rework because his solo lane presence is extremely oppressive in certain match ups and useless in others. It can be a small rework like the xin zhao one, but I think it needs to be done for both fiddle players and people who play against him.
Digielf (NA)
: {{champion:9}}
Why... why get my hopes up?
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